Smaller gun

1060 Views 34 Replies 13 Participants Last post by Shipwreck, 2 mo ago

Shipwreck

Discussion Starter · 2 mo ago (Edited)

I bought a Glock 42 recently, and it is just not reliable. I've tried different brands of ammo, and while it worked with 37 rounds of 2 different JHP, it's just not reliable with FMJ. About 8 malfunctions in 277 rounds. Not good enough with reliability for self defense.

And yea, I could keep going. But with the cost of 380 ammo vs the cost of the gun, I'm done with it... I've already spent almost $170 in ammo (with the JHP rounds counted too)... I'm not going to shoot it anymore...

If ya watch reviews and read gun forums - the gun works 100% for some people, and not for others. So, it's not a huge surprise...

I've been looking at other 380 alternatives... The Sig 365 in 380, the Ruger LCP Max, and even the LCP2. I have a 1st gen Ruger LCP - and I do not really like that gun. At least it works 100%, but the trigger sucks. When the bad trigger pull is combined with the recoil, the gun is not pleasant to shoot.

I'd be willing to deal with the recoil if the trigger was better - so, I even started looking at the LCP2.

However, after watching enough Youtube reviews, all 3 of these guns seem prone to jamming to various degrees. After losing the $ on the Glock 42, and not feeling right selling the gun with the reliability problems... I don't want to take a chance on another 380 again... I know some here have one that runs 100%. But on other gun forums, there are enough tales of woe on all three of these guns to give me pause. And, combined with the video reviews I have watched in the last week, I have to pass on all 3.

I will likely buy a SIg 365 in 9mm. I rented it last week. And, I will rent it 1 more time before I buy it. It is not quite as small and light as I wanted (I really wanted that Glock 42 to work). But, it is the smallest 9mm I have found that I like. I do prefer my Shield Plus, but the 365 is a little smaller. And, recoil is not bad...

I had a Kahr PM9 about a decade ago... And while small, I hated that gun. The recoil was probably 2x what it is on the Shield. So, don't want to go any smaller or lighter than the 365.

I'm still irritated about that Glock 42, but my son is happy. He wanted it. And given that I would only get 30% of the value back on a trade in at the gun store, I just gave it to him. Who knows, it may run 100% for him

Anyway - I guess I found my next gun...

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crc4

· #2 · 2 mo ago

I was unaware of some of the .380 problems with reliability. Any ideas as to the failure points?

While I have seven 9x18 pistols with no reliability issues, with the improvements in 9x19 smaller pistols and a variety of ammo I can't see buying anything less than a 9mm.

Sometimes pistols can just be too small.

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Shipwreck

Discussion Starter · #3 · 2 mo ago

crc4 said:
I was unaware of some of the .380 problems with reliability. Any ideas as to the failure points?

While I have seven 9x18 pistols with no reliability issues, with the improvements in 9x19 smaller pistols and a variety of ammo I can't see buying anything less than a 9mm.

Sometimes pistols can just be too small.

I posted part of this on another thread a few days ago - I updated it a bit for your reply, but I think this is the issue: (see below)
----------------

I think this video explains my issue with the Glock 42, and why I suspect the 380 version of the Sig 365 may give me the same issue... While, the 9mm version of the 365 does not. Go to 5:17 on the video to see:

When I shoot, I hold the gun a little different. I have a tremor in my left hand. It is better or worse, depending on the position of my left hand. I actually shoot way better by having my two thumbs sticking up, instead of wrapped around the side of the gun. It minimizes some of the contact f my left hand, and my hand shakes less in this position.

Now, I don't hold the gun crazy, as he does in the video to illustrate how to make the gun jam. But, I think if someone isn't holding it JUST right - it can cause these tiny guns to jam. And, I am seeing malfunctions on MANY Youtube reviews of these 3 guns. Sometimes the same video will have the same gun malfunction on 2 different people in the same review...

I shoot all my guns this way, and have for years. It is never a problem for me. If I shoot the way you are supposed to - then I don't shoot as well...

But, as per this video - these little 380s are a bit more sensitive. And, i suspect that it is my grip that is causing the issue with the Glock 42. We shall see if my son has these issues when he shoots it some more...

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Shipwreck

Discussion Starter · #4 · 2 mo ago

I am still trying to decide if the 365 is small enough compared to the Shield Plus. It barely is, but I think there is enough of a difference for me to get it and carry it on occasions.

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Mister

· #5 · 2 mo ago

S&W Shield Ez 380 IS DEFINITELY worth looking at. My father has one, it’s a blast too shoot and extremely reliable.

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crc4

· #6 · 2 mo ago

Having rather large ham-hands, I never felt comfortable with small-grip pistols. Even my RB S&W 49 revolver was never comfortable until I put Hogue finger-grips on it which lengthen the grip so I could use my whole hand. Otherwise, my pinky was completely off and my ring finger struggled to stay on making my grip somewhat unnatural and forced.

Without a comfortable grip, it's almost impossible to shoot well.

Good luck finding a small pistol that works for you.

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Shipwreck

Discussion Starter · #7 · 2 mo ago

Mister said:
S&W Shield Ez 380 IS DEFINITELY worth looking at. My father has one, it’s a blast too shoot and extremely reliable.

Yes, I have heard it is reliable. But that is bigger than a Shield, not smaller. I need a pocketable 380. That is way too big for what I need

Shipwreck

Discussion Starter · #8 · 2 mo ago

crc4 said:
Having rather large ham-hands, I never felt comfortable with small-grip pistols. Even my RB S&W 49 revolver was never comfortable until I put Hogue finger-grips on it which lengthen the grip so I could use my whole hand. Otherwise, my pinky was completely off and my ring finger struggled to stay on making my grip somewhat unnatural and forced.

Without a comfortable grip, it's almost impossible to shoot well.

Good luck finding a small pistol that works for you.

See, I have smaller hands. I can get all fingers onto a 365 or Shield plus with a flush fit mag. Large grip guns are a problem for me.

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Rich2500

· #9 · 2 mo ago

How about the bodyguard 380, I know nothing about it but they had one in the case next to the lcp max when i got it. Looked like a nice little gun.

Mister

· #10 · 2 mo ago

Shipwreck said:
Yes, I have heard it is reliable. But that is bigger than a Shield, not smaller. I need a pocketable 380. That is way too big for what I need

My dads EDC is a Ruger LC 380, he is a pocket gun guy. It shoots great for him and it’s a real babe magnet too (oh my, where did you get that lovely LC380?) 🤪

SSGN_Doc

· #11 · 2 mo ago

I really know what to recommend. My “mousiest“ mouse guns are a Beretta 21a, and an LCP. Like you, I don’t find tiny guns super pleasant to shoot and practice with.

My own internal debate and trial and error to find the Goldilocks size of handgun that wasn’t too big, wasn’t too small, not too weak, or too overpowered, and wasn’t unrelaible or too difficult to shoot, got me into handguns in the compact size range. If I need something smaller, the J-frame/Glock26 size was about as small as I need or want to go.

I have the LCP basically as my mouse gun that isn’t fun or pleasant to shoot, but will fit when nothing else will, and it will work.

I’ve spent a large portion of my range time over the last year with snubby revolvers, which I never really liked shooting before, based mostly on me not being really good at shooting them, more than anything else. But after putting in the time and effort, I can shoot them pretty well, and don’t find them that punishing or difficult to use as I used to.

This also brought me back to my Glock 26 and using and carrying it more than I have for the last decade. Investors found it to be very reliable and pretty shootable.

All of this has been in the midst of the new micro nines coming out. I’ve looked at them, but now have enough options that I already own, that I don’t have a need or gap in utility that justifies me buying one.

The Beretta Px4 and CZ P07 still remain the handguns that best fit me and that “sweet spot” for ability to carry, conceal, and use well. And the trade offs on smaller guns just don’t work out for me going to anything smaller than the J frames or Glock 26 for sub compact carry 90 plus percent of the time I do choose to carry something smaller.

for folks that don’t already have something compact, with a lot of trigger time invested. The Hellcat and 365 seem like pretty solid recommendations.

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tony pasley

· #12 · 2 mo ago

If getting a pocket gun is what you need just get BIGGER pockets

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Slowalkintexan

· #13 · 2 mo ago

Been carrying and shooting a Grendel P-10 for over ten years, no FYF, totally reliable, accurate and easy to shoot.

Ok, now all of you can go off on it’s internal magazine,

Cypher

· #14 · 2 mo ago

I don't know why anyone would buy a Glock 42 on a Glock 43 is available.

Shipwreck

Discussion Starter · #15 · 2 mo ago

Cypher said:
I don't know why anyone would buy a Glock 42 on a Glock 43 is available.

I've fired the Glock 43X. It is way more snappy than the Shield. I did not care for the recoil at all. The 43 is even smaller. I would imagine it is less fun to shoot. It is also larger than the 365.

I just finished watching enough reviews of tons of pocket guns. On so many of them, the gun jams on the various 380s for many of the Youtube reviewers.

And, I don't think I am going to buy the 365.

It is still pushing it in size of a pocket pistol. It's still rather heavy. And while doable (like the Shield Plus is) - it's not really hiding that well. I also am not a fan of Sig's recent polymer guns.

I give up. I'll just stick with my Shield Plus on my waist. And, I guess I should practice more with my original LCP. It is reliable.

I was looking for something to pocket carry, when I don't feel like strapping on a holster on my waist. But, I can't find anything reliable enough. And, I'm not wiling to take chances and buy something just to see. I did that with the G42. And with 380 ammo prices, it is too expensive to experiment. I spent 1/2 the cost of the Glock 42 in ammo, and I don't have anything to show for it...

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hike1272.mail

· #16 · 2 mo ago

crc4 said:
I was unaware of some of the .380 problems with reliability. Any ideas as to the failure points?

While I have seven 9x18 pistols with no reliability issues, with the improvements in 9x19 smaller pistols and a variety of ammo I can't see buying anything less than a 9mm.

Sometimes pistols can just be too small.

Limp Wristing -- improper grip that permits the pistol to move

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hike1272.mail

· #17 · 2 mo ago

Shipwreck said:
I bought a Glock 42 recently, and it is just not reliable. I've tried different brands of ammo, and while it worked with 37 rounds of 2 different JHP, it's just not reliable with FMJ. About 8 malfunctions in 277 rounds. Not good enough with reliability for self defense.

And yea, I could keep going. But with the cost of 380 ammo vs the cost of the gun, I'm done with it... I've already spent almost $170 in ammo (with the JHP rounds counted too)... I'm not going to shoot it anymore...

If ya watch reviews and read gun forums - the gun works 100% for some people, and not for others. So, it's not a huge surprise...

I've been looking at other 380 alternatives... The Sig 365 in 380, the Ruger LCP Max, and even the LCP2. I have a 1st gen Ruger LCP - and I do not really like that gun. At least it works 100%, but the trigger sucks. When the bad trigger pull is combined with the recoil, the gun is not pleasant to shoot.

I'd be willing to deal with the recoil if the trigger was better - so, I even started looking at the LCP2.

However, after watching enough Youtube reviews, all 3 of these guns seem prone to jamming to various degrees. After losing the $ on the Glock 42, and not feeling right selling the gun with the reliability problems... I don't want to take a chance on another 380 again... I know some here have one that runs 100%. But on other gun forums, there are enough tales of woe on all three of these guns to give me pause. And, combined with the video reviews I have watched in the last week, I have to pass on all 3.

I will likely buy a SIg 365 in 9mm. I rented it last week. And, I will rent it 1 more time before I buy it. It is not quite as small and light as I wanted (I really wanted that Glock 42 to work). But, it is the smallest 9mm I have found that I like. I do prefer my Shield Plus, but the 365 is a little smaller. And, recoil is not bad...

I had a Kahr PM9 about a decade ago... And while small, I hated that gun. The recoil was probably 2x what it is on the Shield. So, don't want to go any smaller or lighter than the 365.

I'm still irritated about that Glock 42, but my son is happy. He wanted it. And given that I would only get 30% of the value back on a trade in at the gun store, I just gave it to him. Who knows, it may run 100% for him

Anyway - I guess I found my next gun...

The P365/9mm and the P365/380 are the same sized pistol. If the 9mm is too large, the 380 will be also. For me, the 380 sights are vastly inferior to the XRay3 sights on the 9mm. I generally change sights to those that I am used to and that work well for me.
IMHO, the Ruger 380s are not worth having. Colon Noir aside, they are too small for getting a good, solid grip on.
The same think for the S&W Bodyguard 380 though it is, IMHO, superior to anything that Ruger offers. It is small but easily fits into my hand.

The Glock 42 is a pistol that I have had good success with. A range buddy saw that I was limp wristing the G42 and showed me how to grip it. It ran all the ammo and types that I feed it. Better shooters have taught/trained me that the problem rests with me and not the pistol. (This is a general rule that I have never seen fail in my experience.)
My suggestion: before buying another pistol (to solve your problem), it might be useful to have a lesson with an experienced, certified instructor who can analyze how you are shooting your G42. An instructor who likes and has a good bit of experience with Glocks and the G42/43. It is probably something simple and it's not as costly as any of the pistols that you mentioned as possible purchases.

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hike1272.mail

· #18 · 2 mo ago

crc4 said:
I was unaware of some of the .380 problems with reliability. Any ideas as to the failure points?

While I have seven 9x18 pistols with no reliability issues, with the improvements in 9x19 smaller pistols and a variety of ammo I can't see buying anything less than a 9mm.

Sometimes pistols can just be too small.

Based on OP's description, the problem is not that the P42 is too small.
Limp Wristing is an issue that many shooters have/face. The OP's description sounds like it is limp wristing. LW is an "unknown" problem -- the shooter doesn't know that they are limp wristing the pistol. Limp wristing is caused with an improper grip. I do it with smaller pistols and range buddies have pointed it out and shown how to correct it to me. It's a simple fix. This happens all the time with improperly gripped pistol. It can easily be replicated on 9mm and larger caliber pistol. (Though on the Desert Eagle, the limp wristed pistol is likely to jump out of the shooter's hand.)
Don't Blame The Pistol! --> that's what I was taught and have found to be true.

tony pasley

· #19 · 2 mo ago

Ship have you thought about an old Colt Pony or their mini1911 in 380. both are small 380.

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mur.cap

· #20 · 2 mo ago

hike1272.mail said:
Based on OP's description, the problem is not that the P42 is too small.
Limp Wristing is an issue that many shooters have/face. The OP's description sounds like it is limp wristing. LW is an "unknown" problem -- the shooter doesn't know that they are limp wristing the pistol. Limp wristing is caused with an improper grip. I do it with smaller pistols and range buddies have pointed it out and shown how to correct it to me. It's a simple fix. This happens all the time with improperly gripped pistol. It can easily be replicated on 9mm and larger caliber pistol. (Though on the Desert Eagle, the limp wristed pistol is likely to jump out of the shooter's hand.)
Don't Blame The Pistol! --> that's what I was taught and have found to be true.

For carry purposes the 9mm is the best all round pistol with plenty of ammo choices. 9 Shields are flat and carry a sufficient number of rounds for an incident. If you feel you need more, carry a larger capacity pistol. .380 are pocket gun rounds and went by the wayside with the Walther PPK, now a heavy pistol which weighs more than a 9 Shield and carries less rounds at six or seven. Mine's a "safe queen." I goosed my 9 Shield mag capacity to ten rounds for a total of eleven with Mag Guts springs. It's also a pocket fit with a green laser guard sight. Skip the boutique guns. There are plenty of Smiths and you get a lifetime warranty. Decide if you want a handgun for target use, carry purposes or as a hobby. Some people have more handguns than ties in the their wardrobe closet. The gun manufacturers keep coming up with new gimmick guns every year. That's why all the new .380 versions. Then they say you can raise the pressure of a .380 to almost a 9mm. Huh? The Left Wing keeps trying to Deep Six them all anyway. That's where the concern is. There is no magic gun at the end of the rainbow of bucket ammo. Be Safe Everyone.

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