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Anyone make a modification to your carry gun?

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Other than night sights, I generally lean away from mods to a carry gun..

Lawyers can/will try anything-
"Gee, Mr. Smith, your gun is black.. In our culture, black is often regarded as representing evil. Are you evil?"

Also, heavily modifying the internals can affect reliabilty if not done right. As much as I might think that me or my local smith might be able to make a gun work better, the engineers who designed it lived, ate, and breathed with it in their head for a few years.

Whereas with nightsights, you can at least use the rationale: "I put them on to better identify my target and improve my accuracy in a stressful situation, so as to reduce the risk to innocent bystanders.." Also, you can get nightsights as OEM from the factory, so they're legal dept. probably gave it some examination.

Oh, and not that it's automatically true, but Ayoob discusses a 1989 case involving handloads and the troubles it caused in the May/June 06 American Handgunner..
 

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spacedoggy said:
First I'm new to forums on the internet and got lucky with this one being one of the first. I have read a lot of articles on the internet involving gun issues and I don't always believe what I read or I would be a gun control freak. I searched for some of the stuff I've read within the last week and gave up after an hour. Then I'm sitting on my throne and start reading for the tenth time the magazine COMBAT HANDGUNS. Time to buy new ones. It has an article by Massad Ayoob titled LIGHT TRIGGER LIABILITY (Why "hair triggers" can hang you in court-four case reports give fair warning!) After reading this I myself would not carry a gun that has had the trigger adjusted just to be on the safe side. I would practice with the one I carry to where a light trigger pull is not needed. On the other side a light pull might save your life in a bad situation. I'm going to change my G21c to a 3.5 lb pull to see what it's like and hope it helps when I get into competition.
There are so many anti-gun people in our justice system and a lot of DA's are anti-gun. I thought this to be a good topic even if it's been brought up in other forums. I think the poll results are interesting.
It's just my personal opinion, but I don't put much weight into Ayoob's pronouncements.
 

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This will always be a topic for much discussion. And there is certainly not anything wrong with continued discussion, especially since, in this forum at least, it has been done very politely and tastefully.
I personally don't think the question will ever be answered as to the liability of modifications on a pistol used for self defense until we see something on hard copy from the courts. Gun mags and writers love throwing this around and that's OK. I just wish somebody, anybody, would give us one little positive linky that we could trust that would sway me a little.
Oh by the way, I don't want to offend anyone but puttin' a 3.5 lb trigger on a Glock will in no way make it a "hair trigger", IMHO. Changing a 5.5 lb. single action trigger to a 3.5 lb. single action trigger MAY make a difference in a crisis situation but I would bet not. I've owned 5 different Glocks in the last 9 years, most with 5.5 lb. triggers and one with a 3.5 lb. trigger. There is no way you're gonna accidently pull one quicker than the other. If you're gonna' over-react, you're gonna over-react!

Rant off. :goofy:
 

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One more thing. What we are discussing here is based on logic and some common sense, and we can all see that. But courts, judges, & lawyers are NOT bound by common sense or logic. Many times (seemingly getting to be more and more) logic and common sense have ABSOLUTELY NOTHING to do with the outcomes of court cases. I personally have lost all faith in our judges and court system. I know several good, intelligent, logical people that became judges and within six months whatever part of the brain deals in logic had totally disintegrated.



Ok, OK, really.......rant is OFF.
 

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It's just my personal opinion, but I don't put much weight into Ayoob's pronouncements
+1 The guy can tell a good story though.....

This will always be a topic for much discussion. And there is certainly not anything wrong with continued discussion, especially since, in this forum at least, it has been done very politely and tastefully.
I personally don't think the question will ever be answered as to the liability of modifications on a pistol used for self defense until we see something on hard copy from the courts. Gun mags and writers love throwing this around and that's OK. I just wish somebody, anybody, would give us one little positive linky that we could trust that would sway me a little.
Oh by the way, I don't want to offend anyone but puttin' a 3.5 lb trigger on a Glock will in no way make it a "hair trigger", IMHO. Changing a 5.5 lb. single action trigger to a 3.5 lb. single action trigger MAY make a difference in a crisis situation but I would bet not. I've owned 5 different Glocks in the last 9 years, most with 5.5 lb. triggers and one with a 3.5 lb. trigger. There is no way you're gonna accidently pull one quicker than the other. If you're gonna' over-react, you're gonna over-react!
+1 again. I think a lot is going to depend on the 'cultue' where the 'incident' takes place. The A-hole lawyers know what they can get away with, and where they can get away with it!!!!

Know what you call 1,000 lawyers at the bottom of the ocean...........a good start. :-D
 

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I have never really been much on modifications. I guess if I owned a 1911 that would be a different story. I am sure it would..lol I bought both my XD-40 and my Sig P220 with Night Sights already installed. I love them and couldn't see having a carry weapon without them. I've also thought about installing a tactical light on my XD but, I can't justify doing so. I have a good flashlight by my side for anything that might go bump in the night and every where I carry, night sights are sufficient most of the time.
 

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spacedoggy said:
I don't think night sites count or polish the ramp, thats cleaning maint. in my book. Most of the stuff I read was on tigger pulls and I don't think I'd want to carry a comp 1911 even though that would be my gun of choice. You can even get in trouble shooting someone with your own reloads.
I don't think you would get in trouble with reloads as long as you stayed within the specs for the round you are loading. Where using factory ammo helps is if you do ge into a lawsuit, the ammo manufaturer would also have their lawyer there to defend themselves. In a lawsuit every party involved gets sued. Gun maunufacturer, ammo manufacturer and you. If you shoot reloads or modify your weapon you will be on your own.
 

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article by Massad Ayoob titled LIGHT TRIGGER LIABILITY
This man makes a living off writing been scaring people since 80's that I know of. Their might be a case here and their but I'm not going to loose sleep over it.

I have ask people to show me a case where a person took 2 hits from a 380 HP in chest and went on to serious injure of kill the person with 380.
Once again likely it has happened but no one has ever showed me a actual case. Several where ball failed went clean thru still waiting on the HP.. Yet people will tell you in 380 only use ball.

People can sue you for anything. In some states , they can arrest you. On word of a person and a claimed witness. I know this as fact from personal experiance. In other words Bubba and bubbas boyfriend can say you assualted him and guess who will get arrested and have to prove he didn't do it.
 
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When i'm 21 I plan on using my good old reliable Security Six and what I plan on doing is cutting the spur off the hammer and polishing it. That way I will have a DA only revolver. Then I wont have to worry about it snagging on anything if God forbid I have to use it as self defense.
 

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Maser..

Im 48 and i can safely say from experience that by the time you turn 21 (if you live long enough in kalifornistan to turn 21) your taste in firearms will have probably changed SEVERAL times :roll: :roll:
 

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Re: Maser..

scooter said:
Im 48 and i can safely say from experience that by the time you turn 21 (if you live long enough in kalifornistan to turn 21) your taste in firearms will have probably changed SEVERAL times :roll: :roll:
Ain't that the truth. I kinda changed out all my older guns last year because I wanted a change. And, I was working an extra job last year - watching the community service workers pick up trash on the highway - I made $21+ an hour, and it was just 5 hours every Sat. So, I got the opportunity to use that money for many guns. Some I kept, some I didn't like for vaarious reasons, and traded them away. I only did that job to fund my gun collection.

After a year of it, I was tired of doing it every Sat. But now, I miss the money.

I'd like to find an extra 1 day a week p/t job again - but any kind of job will only pay $6-$8 for that - I won't find a sweet deal like that again ($21+ an hour) - I don't work for that particular county anymore, so I can't get it back. And, my county only gives comp time for doing it on Saturdays. They won't actually pay you the overtime.
 
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I doubt my tastes in guns will change. I have always liked revolvers over semi autos. Also I have developed lots of experience with the Security Six. Shooting it DA mode is a dream for me and I am relativly accurate with it. Sure, I only have 6 shots, but those shots will always be there and not jam like a semi auto can. :wink:

The funny thing about me and handguns that has changed is the fact that when I was younger I used to get a big kick (literally) out of shooting big guns such as .454 casull or .50AE. Nowadays I am more happier shooting .38 specials.
 

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Maser said:
I doubt my tastes in guns will change. I have always liked revolvers over semi autos. Also I have developed lots of experience with the Security Six. Shooting it DA mode is a dream for me and I am relativly accurate with it. Sure, I only have 6 shots, but those shots will always be there and not jam like a semi auto can. :wink:

The funny thing about me and handguns that has changed is the fact that when I was younger I used to get a big kick (literally) out of shooting big guns such as .454 casull or .50AE. Nowadays I am more happier shooting .38 specials.
Quote:
Originally Posted by hberttmank
Welcome Maser. Lots of good info to be found on this site. Everyone needs at least one 1911.

Yeah, i'm soaking up the info so far like a sponge. Honestly, when I turn 21 I want my first handgun I buy to be a .50AE Desert Eagle with titanium finish, but now after reading about 1911s, I think I may just have to change my mind.

???
 

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2400 said:
Maser said:
I doubt my tastes in guns will change. I have always liked revolvers over semi autos. Also I have developed lots of experience with the Security Six. Shooting it DA mode is a dream for me and I am relativly accurate with it. Sure, I only have 6 shots, but those shots will always be there and not jam like a semi auto can. :wink:

The funny thing about me and handguns that has changed is the fact that when I was younger I used to get a big kick (literally) out of shooting big guns such as .454 casull or .50AE. Nowadays I am more happier shooting .38 specials.
Quote:
Originally Posted by hberttmank
Welcome Maser. Lots of good info to be found on this site. Everyone needs at least one 1911.

Yeah, i'm soaking up the info so far like a sponge. Honestly, when I turn 21 I want my first handgun I buy to be a .50AE Desert Eagle with titanium finish, but now after reading about 1911s, I think I may just have to change my mind.

???
I won't even get into the research I've been doing the last couple days. Just stick with your "????" and leave it at that. Trust me.
 

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jwkimber45 said:
I won't even get into the research I've been doing the last couple days. Just stick with your "????" and leave it at that. Trust me.
I wasn't doing any research, it's not worth the effort. I ran across that this morning on the 1911 forum.
 
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