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  1. #21
    Cat's Avatar
    Cat
    Cat is offline Member
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  3. #22
    Steve M1911A1's Avatar
    Steve M1911A1 is online now Senior Member
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    Packard and Dave;
    If you wish to use either the .45 ACP or the .45 "Long" Colt round, why buy a Governor? Instead, buy a pistol that is purpose-chambered for the round you want to use.
    Because of its long cylinder, the shorter .45 ACP and .45 "Long" Colt rounds will not perform anywhere nearly as well in a Governor as they would in a properly-chambered pistol.
    I suggest that the only practical reason to own a Governor is to use .410 shotshells in it. Its "convertability" is a mirage meant only to bolster sales.
    But even when using .410 shotshells, the Governor is at a disadvantage because its rifled barrel causes bird- and buck-shot to disperse too quickly and relatively uncontrollably. Further, even the special "antipersonnel" loads sold for use in it lack adequate fight-stopping penetration. Thus, it is a very-close-range-only weapon, best suited, perhaps, to dispatching snakes.
    Rather than relying upon "the shotgun effect" promised by the Governor (and, by extension, the Judge), a more practical approach would be to invest your time in learning to shoot any really effective defensive pistol well enough to assure yourself that you can stop any fight in which someone else involves you.

    There are no "miracle cures" which will absolve you from practicing to become an effective, accurate pistol shooter.
    The "shotgun effect" is a mirage, and will not save your life in a time of need.

  4. #23
    hideit's Avatar
    hideit is offline Senior Member
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    Yes it is a very specialized gun
    I don't understand why they don't come in 6" or 8" barrels

    The longer the barrel the more energy and accuracy.
    Maybe ruger will beat every body to that barrel length.

  5. #24
    DaveShooter is offline Junior Member
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    Steve ? Have you shot the Judge or better yet the new S&W Gov???? I wish I could show you my target from a 7-yds this past weekend. I think you just might change your mind about this weapon,- with the new 410 Defense ammo that is aval today. Heck even 230 grain ACP- hardball shot unreal in this revolver. A very very tight group. Not picking a fight but this new Smith is great with the right ammo for defense. As far as cylinder length please come out of the dark ages. 22 revolvers have been chambered in 22-lr, long,& 22 short for yrs. Not to mentin the 327 cartridge in 4 loadings alone and one very accurate piece as well. the list of other guns that can chamber shorter length cartridges is long at that and they shoot just fine. If ya don't believe me shoot some for yourself and see the answer on target....... Oh this revolver is chambered in 45-Acp, 45 Colt, and 410 self-defense , and shotshels, I bet it will even be able to take the 45GAP round in moon -clips as well to answer your question Steve......... about chambering.........

  6. #25
    VAMarine's Avatar
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    Bragging about groups/targets @ 7 yards is kind of like bragging about dunking on a 5' rim.

  7. #26
    VAMarine's Avatar
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    As for the cylinder performance issue, shorter cartridges in longer cylinders (like a .38 in a .357) will have lower velocities and the difference will vary with gap between the cartridge and the forcing cone. With a .38 out of a .357 the gap isn't that large. With a .45ACP (which is not know for blazing velocities to begin with) and the empty space used for chambering a .410 bore load you're going to lose some umph, as the barrel length is all ready below 3" you'd have less muzzle velocity than a 3" 1911...probably less then 750/700fps. The .45LC will be probably be worse pending on loadings.

    Would be an interesting experiment for the ballistics by the inch guys.

  8. #27
    Packard is offline Senior Member
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    I thought that my first choice would be the NightGuard 325; .45 ACP, 6 rounds. But it is nearly the same weight as the Governor, and lists out at over $1,000.00. That makes for a pretty big spread in dollars. I would probably choose the Governor in light of the cost differential.

    Note: The NightGuard comes with nicer sights, but does not accept any of the alternative ammunition. It is more compact than the Governor.

    http://www.smith-wesson.com/webapp/w...layErrorView_Y

    http://www.smith-wesson.com/webapp/w...layErrorView_Y

  9. #28
    VAMarine's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Packard View Post
    I thought that my first choice would be the NightGuard 325; .45 ACP, 6 rounds. But it is nearly the same weight as the Governor, and lists out at over $1,000.00. That makes for a pretty big spread in dollars. I would probably choose the Governor in light of the cost differential.

    Note: The NightGuard comes with nicer sights, but does not accept any of the alternative ammunition. It is more compact than the Governor.
    You can get the 325 NG for under $900. As for the pricing of the Governor, it has to compete against the Taurus product, hence the lower cost. It is the lowest costing Scandium frame revolver S&W has ever released. Every other Scandium revolver from S&W is almost twice the cost of the Governor.

    I'd shop around for a used 325PD.

  10. #29
    DaveShooter is offline Junior Member
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    I am not bragging about my group. Just saying this revolver- The S&W Gov, is fine for a self-defense application with the right self defense ammo. I do not think the Bad Guy will ask for another round. If ya doubt what I am saying try one out and you'll see what I am saying. I gave $575.00 new in the box for my S&W Gov- not $900.00 for a S&W325 Night Guard. Maybe a Smith 625 at 900.00.....

  11. #30
    VAMarine's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cat View Post

    Supposedly that ammo has been banned for import by the ATF, so we won't be seeing that used any time soon.

    Quote Originally Posted by DaveShooter View Post
    I am not bragging about my group. Just saying this revolver- The S&W Gov, is fine for a self-defense application with the right self defense ammo. I do not think the Bad Guy will ask for another round. If ya doubt what I am saying try one out and you'll see what I am saying. I gave $575.00 new in the box for my S&W Gov- not $900.00 for a S&W325 Night Guard. Maybe a Smith 625 at 900.00.....

    Do you plan on carrying this thing? a sub 3" bbl revolver with the overall length of a 5" 1911?

  12. #31
    DaveShooter is offline Junior Member
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    I carry it everyday on the trail I walk 6.2 to 10 miles a day. Been fighting type 2 diabetes. Lost 63 lbs since this past june.
    I honestly like my S&W Gov. Have had Taurus nothing but issues and problems. This S&W product rocks on.

  13. #32
    Blacklion66 is offline Junior Member
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    Have Both

    The governor does have a sweet trigger pull like most S&Ws, from the hip rapid fire I can keep all shots inside a pie-tin at 10 feet, the #6 shot shell is good on grouse out to about 20 feet from my judge, my only grip on the judge is the double action trigger pull is pretty heavy.

    As for the guns not being accurate, my S&W will shoot coffee cup groups single-action at 50 feet, I fired my 1st handgun when I was in the 6th grade (1941) and have burnt my share of powder since then, it is rather ammusing to read some of the posts by self proclaimed experts, a little like watching some young bucks argue about which car is the best

    One parting shot: you only use a handgun in a gunfight if the 12 gauge is empty or out of reach

  14. #33
    DV731 is offline Junior Member
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    First of all, how a gun looks is fine for personal taste if your a range junkie, and I've bought quite a few on that stipulation, but when it hits the fan, it does not matter. How what you're carrying feels in your hand, which is different for each individual, how it performs, and your level of familiarity and training with the weapon is the biggest deal. A lot of people rag on the concept behind the Judge, and the Gov'nr now, but every gun frame/concept/load is designed for situational use.

    Different guns are for different things, period. I carry a poly public defender more often than not these days, but I don't take the thing to the range, it hurts like a sob to start with. As some guys have pointed out, it's not a target gun, so putting shots on paper after seven yards, whether with .45 LC or .410 is just dealers choice as far as where the round/spread is going. For up close and personal, sudden in your face conflict, they're both keepers, though. No disrespect to Packard, but brother I don't know how familiar you are with assassins but no, that's not what this gun is either. Silent and deadly ops are low velocity, low cal ammo with cans.

    The Judge is loud, inaccurate over a few feet, and does not control well. So standing off a mugger? Absolutely. Walking into a convenient store to buy a pack of smokes? Sure. Killing rattlers? You got it. The concept is solid IF you are using the right gun for the right job. It's a revolver, for heaven's sake, it's for a one or two shot conflict. People say bring enough gun. More so, bring the right gun. On the job I holster a full size .45. Call me old school. On the nightstand, Sig 220 with Tridium and surefire, extended mag. Just think where you're going to be/shooting from/shooting at.

    I sure hope I don't need a 1911 and three extra mags to go grocery shopping, but hey the world is always getting worse. For now, though, all in all I would recommend the Judge, haven't shot the S&W but can't be to different, as having owned, carried, and used it for it's designated purpose. Good gun. Solid construction. Looks mean, but then back to looks thing, and if you pull it, you better be shooting it.

  15. #34
    theycallmejam's Avatar
    theycallmejam is offline Junior Member
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    When I first saw the Judge, I thought that the 3 different round you can use was brilliant, on the other hand,that was when I saw it, i was NOT an owner of a hand gun at the time. then I saw the Governor, I am more familiar with Smith and Wesson, So I like the Governor a little more. I like the versatility or the 410, and 45lc, and 45lcp. But I am just a shoot for fun/home defense kinda guy. If someone had broke into my home while I was sleeping, while it was pitch black, and I heard a noise, the 410 would make them go
    away, or the sound would make them poo there pants and leave, fast.......or if I had a laser on some other pistol, they might rethink there theivery, and leave

  16. #35
    Steve M1911A1's Avatar
    Steve M1911A1 is online now Senior Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by theycallmejam View Post
    ...If someone had broke into my home while I was sleeping...the 410 would make them go
    away, or the sound would make them poo there pants and leave, fast...[emphasis added]
    What sound?
    Do you think that the Governor has a slide to rack?
    Or would you merely shoot first?

    The .410 is an ineffective round, even when loaded expressly for one of these revolvers.
    Used with .45 "Long" Colt or .45 ACP, these guns are large and unhandy, and relatively inaccurate. If you want to shoot a .45 pistol round, then buy a .45 "Long" Colt or .45 ACP pistol.

    The Governor, just like the Judge, is merely a gimmick.
    And not a good one, either.

  17. #36
    jdw68 is offline Member
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    I have never shot the judge or the governer. I have heard that the long cylinder makes them inaccurate, but haven't tested for myself. I have never wanted this design mainly because I have always thought they were big, heavy, and unattractive. It just looks like an ugly gun to me, and adding all that size just to accomodate the 410 shell doesn't seem practical. I would never want a 410 out of a short barrel for anything!

  18. #37
    bsj177 is offline Junior Member
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    Hey guys new to the forum. I have a question about the 410 rounds for the Governor. I know the Governor takes the 2.5 inch rounds but some models of the Judge will take the 3 inch 410 rounds. Does the length of the round make a difference? Would that be an advantage to the Judge?

    I know there is a lot of controversy about these guns and I dont want to go into that...just curious on if the longer rounds would be more effective

    thanks!!

  19. #38
    VAMarine's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bsj177 View Post
    Hey guys new to the forum. I have a question about the 410 rounds for the Governor. I know the Governor takes the 2.5 inch rounds but some models of the Judge will take the 3 inch 410 rounds. Does the length of the round make a difference? Would that be an advantage to the Judge?

    I know there is a lot of controversy about these guns and I dont want to go into that...just curious on if the longer rounds would be more effective

    thanks!!
    The Box O' Truth #41 - The Taurus Judge Vs. The Box O' Truth - Page 1

    The Box O' Truth #53 - The Taurus Judge, Revisited - Page 1


    Lessons learned:
    1. The 3 inch .410 shells did slightly better than the 2 inch shells did. But most of them still failed to make the 12 inch minimum penetration standard. However, a few loads made the minimum penetration standard.
    2. Some of the pellets deviated sharply from their path and left the water jugs.
    3. The longer barrel of the 28 inch shotgun made quite a difference in penetration. It seems that the short 3 inch barrel of the Judge is its main limitation.
    4. Even at 7 yards, the pattern of the Judge is too wide, and will cause some of the load to miss a bad guy. Not only are you responsible for every pellet you send down range, but if they miss him, they do not Stop him.
    5. The sun was shining, it was a blue bird day, and it was better than any day I ever spent at work.
    6. It’s fun to shoot stuff.
    Many thanks to ArmedSuspect and Ashby Arms in Harrisonburg, VA, for supplying the Judge and ammo for this test. And thanks to Vern and Bill for the help hauling all that water.


  20. #39
    bsj177 is offline Junior Member
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    thanks for the links...interesting stuff

  21. #40
    GunByte is offline Junior Member
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    I just love arm chair experts. Many of these comments remind me of what was said about Glocks when they first came out. Stupid idea and what were they thinking of.

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