Which pistol is found more in the hands of Law Enforcement & the Military

I suspect that Glock "owns" the "Pro" market (I am using the term loosely). The military has a lot of M9s, but not every Soldier, Sailor, Airman, or Marine is issued a sidearm. The largest portion of GIs (no matter what service) carry a rifle. My unit had 25 M-16A2's assigned to it, but we had only two M9s. The SFC, and the LT were the only ones that got a sidearm (or even got to qualify). The military has a large number of M9's, a few SIG 228's (aka M11), a few 1911A1's, a few Ruger's (P89 I think, USA Material Command, and USA Trans. Comm.), and even fewer still MK23's. NYPD alone has appx. 38,000 officers, a large number of those officers carry a Glock. Our local PD issues the Glock 22, my office is deputy preference. I have not taken a poll, but I did an informal count this evening. Glock holds down about 50%, 1911a1 holds down appx. 30%, Beretta has probably 10%, with 5% going to Sig, the rest are S&W, H&K, one Kahr, and one guy with a Browning HP. I may be missing something, but Glock seems to have the market well in hand. S&W seem to be making inroads with the M&P.

KL
:smt1099

Bean counters often have a say in what weapon officers carry. You carry what the department issues. If you think that all LEO's are into guns as much as the people on this forum you would be mistaken. Many could give a rip.

Now you might find it interesting what is carried when politics and department mandates don't apply. For officers who are into their guns some would still pick the Glock for it's dependability but others might just pick a slicked up 1911. I know a few who have. :mrgreen:

Have to laugh. Early 70's my partner and I were real outsiders because we carried S&W 39's in 9mm. Next city the chief hated 39's and worked to have them replaced with S&W 19's. Half the story was to have same ammo as every other cop.
Now my old PD carries just about everything except a revolver. 9's, 40's, 45's. Can't find a Mod 39 anywhere. Like a 1911 in 45 myself but a brother carries a S&W in 10mm. Hard to find any ammo in 10mm so we reload.

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Originally Posted by ThorOdinson

Have to laugh. Early 70's my partner and I were real outsiders because we carried S&W 39's in 9mm. Next city the chief hated 39's and worked to have them replaced with S&W 19's. Half the story was to have same ammo as every other cop.
Now my old PD carries just about everything except a revolver. 9's, 40's, 45's. Can't find a Mod 39 anywhere. Like a 1911 in 45 myself but a brother carries a S&W in 10mm. Hard to find any ammo in 10mm so we reload.

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Georgia Arms has GREAT prices on 10mm defense loads (+p hollowpoints to be exact).

And to stay on topic with this thread I should probably mention I've noticed a lot more LEs lately with Sigs rather than Glocks.

Im in the Washington DC area and here MPD(dc police dept) carry Glocks. MD state police just got the Beretta P-4 storm in .40cal. Pg county are using 92-F Berettas amd the United States Park police are using Heckler Kochs p2000 in .40cal or P7 in 9mm.

My daughter just got on a local Police Dept. here in West Central Florida. They & several other PD's she applied to use Glocks. One other carries the Sig 229.

In the city I live in all LEO have SIGs...When I pay a visit to the police station to obtain my purchase permit I have to wait for 15 to 30 minutes, during this time I examine the passers by officers and they all have SIGs.

My neighbour is a police officer for the neighbouring township though, and his station issues Glocks..He is a HUGE GLOCK fan, but he hasn't been able to convince me of buying one yet..:watching:

I realize Glocks are more widely used in police agencies in the u.s and Beretas now in the seivce but in poll I said colt because for the amount of time the colt was in service I would assume the surplus of them still in use far exceeds the new issue of the berettas! now if were talking internationally wow thats a stumper!

Some might remember that the Armed Forces carried .38 special revolvers early on. When they needed something with more immediate effect they went to .45ACP and the 1911.
I could pick my own firearm on my first PD and it was a .357. Second was the same. Along came the S&W 39 in 9mm. Liked to shoot it (haven't seen one in years) but the 9mm was a tad wimpy when my life was on the line. Third PD started out liking the M39 but went to the M19 with .38 Plus P's. Most guys dumped the .38's during car check out and in went the .357's. Now its back to the .45. A few Glock's and SIG's but the 1911 is no stranger usually in SS.
Can't believe what I saw the last Police Agent wearing. Must have had 50 lbs of cuffs, mags, stun guns, semi-auto, keys, baton loop, MagLite etc., etc.
We used to have blazers, that covered a M39, couple of mags and cuffs hung over our belt with a couple of big wire ties threaded through the belt loops.
Remember how Chrysler had the biggest share of the cruiser marker because they made Plymouths with "police packages". Probably the same with weapons bought by cities or counties--voila the Glocks!
My family liked the idea of something with some punch (face it--killing power) instead of a 9mm or wimped down 10mm (40 cal).
I even got a captain to approve a M29 (he didn't know what it was) but I never carried it. It did do a nice job on an elk!
So desk jockies might like a 9mm but when it came down to the real thing everybody sure liked a .45 cal 230 JHP. Thor

PS I still have my Kel Lite which I use for a dumbell. And it is aluminum! .....well do ya punk! :buttkick:

Beretta especially since they just got another contract with the military a few months back. Sigs were big for a while but with the introduction of polymer guns with glock then xds its a toss up. I would never see the Military going to a glock or simliar gun as well. We dont have the brightest people in the military and they would shott themselfs with no safety other then their finger. (although i did watch an officer rack a round, pull the mag out look at it, put it back in the gun and dry fire it into the firing barrel.... bang turned in shock pulled the trigger angain bang shot a guy in the leg and dropped the gun... it was a beretta to)

Amazing story. Haven't looked at a Beretta in years. They don't have safeties? We used to guard a hole in a fence around an operations building in S. Japan. To break the boredom we timed how fast we could field strip a Colt 1911 .45. We knew how it worked down to the gnats a**.
Surprised the guy didn't rack a round, look down the barrel and pull the trigger.
A salesman in a gun shop was demonstrating a S&W 4506 (empty) and pulled back the slide--so it was cocked and locked. Then he released the safety (which in this model drops the hammer).
Seeing my eyes he 'splained that the firearm had only one trigger and even if loaded would not have fired.
Being double action I guess I would have had to pull the trigger to fire it--might take a little getting used to. :smt1099

Sorry I must not have elaberated enough Beretta does have a saftey that is why the military use them instead of the glocks and xd's

FN maybe????

I've noticed most "tv cops" carry glocks or sigs in 9mm.

Glock is FBI and DEA, among other nationals

I have a Glock and they are great pistols but IMO my XD40 shoots better.

Kind of like Ford vs. Chevy.

my buddy was issued an HK USPc .40 in a virginia PD.

the Local PD uses Glocks

At the range a couple days ago I was talking to an officer who said they were just issued Sigs.

I think its mainly the choice of the sheriff or head of the dept but I have heard that many think SA "locked and cocked" pistols are too unsafe to carry day by day and prefer a DA pull.

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Originally Posted by Supermanwoot

my buddy was issued an HK USPc .40 in a virginia PD.

the Local PD uses Glocks

At the range a couple days ago I was talking to an officer who said they were just issued Sigs.

I think its mainly the choice of the sheriff or head of the dept but I have heard that many think SA "locked and cocked" pistols are too unsafe to carry day by day and prefer a DA pull.

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I think you are probably correct. Even thouigh the head guy rarely is active on the road anymore and may not have any personal experience with the latest thing on the market (I had a chief that was determined to returen to the revolver from a semi-auto) he does hear things from the public.

Cocked and locked pistols alarm citizens who are unaware that they are safe. DA is always a hard pull and doesn't lend itself to an accurate first shot but appearances are everything.

I could draw, cock and shoot a Ruger faster and more accurately than my first chief who had a S&W M&P .38 but the Ruger bugged him. 3rd chief had a revolver but didn't complain when S&W came out with the Mod 39. So it seems to boil down to what they are familiar with even though it's your life. Thor

Here in Santa Fe New Mexico SFPD carries glocks in .40, SFCO sheriffs carry what they want as long as they qualify with it, most of them carry privately owned Kimbers....(bought for work so they get to use it as a tax write off...arrgghh!..lol) and the State Police just got issued S&W M&P's in .45

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Originally Posted by Kyle1337

Here in Santa Fe New Mexico SFPD carries glocks in .40, SFCO sheriffs carry what they want as long as they qualify with it, most of them carry privately owned Kimbers....(bought
for work so they get to use it as a tax write off...arrgghh!..lol) and the State Police just got issued S&W M&P's in .45

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What do you figure is the value of a so called "tax writeoff"? Most people think it is what is correctly termed a "tax credit". Example--If you itemize deductions and one of those deductions is a handgun worth $400.00 how much is "written off"? If the tax payer is in the 25% tax bracket MAYBE you can deduct $100. Remember cops are wage earners, not independant contractors owning their own business. So what does the "arrrrggggh" refer to? The expense the cop has to front just to work in New Mexico or the wrongly perceived "tax writeoff"?

Of the 3 departments I worked for it worked like this. 1) No weapon issued and even uniforms were ones that were altered to fit so they always looked bad. 2) A uniform allowance was paid every 3 months. It was considered by the IRS as income unless return itemized and uniform allowance expenses totalled and posted as an expense. It could easily cost way more just to hire a CPA so you took the standard deduction and forgot about it. If you could squeeze out a few bucks for a weapon and your uniforms looked acceptable that was it. 3) They issued everything including a S&W Mod 39 in 9mm. Turned out that 9mm didn't really have the immediate stopping power needed in some cases. Everyone went back to Mod 19's and officially carried .38+p. Most swapped out the .38 for .357 as soon as they got in the cruiser. Now that Hornady developed a bullet that would expand at handgun velocities (including .357) we have a better chance if push comes to shove.

Personnally I go with a .45 1911 and two backup mags on my person.

I know a lot of times department decisions are based on political and other reasons, but I've seen a lot of smith and wesson m&p's in leo hands lately. There's a lot of them in police supply catalogs, etc especially since they are offering the same type discount deal that glock does. They must be making a push for the leo and military dollar out there.

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Originally Posted by ThorOdinson

I think you are probably correct. Even thouigh the head guy rarely is active on the road anymore and may not have any personal experience with the latest thing on the market (I had a chief that was determined to returen to the revolver from a semi-auto) he does hear things from the public.

Cocked and locked pistols alarm citizens who are unaware that they are safe. DA is always a hard pull and doesn't lend itself to an accurate first shot but appearances are everything.

I could draw, cock and shoot a Ruger faster and more accurately than my first chief who had a S&W M&P .38 but the Ruger bugged him. 3rd chief had a revolver but didn't complain when S&W came out with the Mod 39. So it seems to boil down to what they are familiar with even though it's your life. Thor

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The head guy (chief, sheriff, etc) also has to pacify the city counsel, mayor, county commissioners, etc., and make sure that their department doesn't come off as being unsafe and shoot happy. I know its crap, but politics play a bigger part in the gun decision that actual gun features.

I think the FBI develpmentof the .40 cal is a perfect example. Once 9mm's were found to be marginal the 10mm came to the forefront. See many boxes of 10mm for sale? It is still available but hard to find. It died out after the FBI picked the .40.
I well undestand the possibliy of collateral damage in the event of a through and through but most haven't paid attention to expansion of handgun bullets moving at handgun velocities. Hornady has come up with a solution...but it took decades. Now the energy is transferred to the target and stops.
That hollowpoint looks lethal but proves out to less effective than desired on somebody whacked out on Crystal Meth.

I don't understand how anybody can debate what maker is more widely used within LE and Military. Berettas are standard issue for military. Law enforcements probably carry a majority Glock, but even if LE carried ONLY Glock it would be a close race. I don't see any possible way that Beretta is not the clear winner here.

For the US military it would have to be the Berreta. From what I've seen more local LEO carry mostly Glocks, but the Feds prefer Sigs.