Opinion: Pit Bull

I've never owned a pit, but several of my friends have in the past. The only time I've seen these animals get aggressive, they thought I shouldn't be there or were taken by surprise. A simple scolding by the owner and the dog laid down and went back to a lump on the carpet or changed demeanor and asked for a little loving. I've seen the same traits in the labs/ shepherds I had growing up. Dogs are meant to be big (good first line of home defense). I don't discriminate against breeds but am always cautious around an unfamiliar animal- regardless of size.

caution is good

i have 2 pits that get along fine with every one people oher dogs dosen matter they get a bad rap from retards that have never had one and belives everything the news tells them:numbchuck:

so many more bites than pits little dogs are vicious bites just go unreported

Pit Bulls. Well let's see.

It's about Midnight here in New Mexico on a Saturday night. I'm sitting in my office with my best friend since Sept '01. Lady Bug is a Lab mix that I rescued from a bad home/environment when she was about two years old. I have been a dog owner/lover for about 45 years, and I can say without reservation that Lady Bug is the best dog I have ever known, and I've owned a lot. I own my own business, and this has allowed Lady Bug and I to spend almost every minute of every day together for the last eight years. She has literally been my shadow - where I go, my shadow follows.

Over Labor Day weekend, (two weeks ago) Lady Bug got deathly ill, could not/would not eat, was throwing up, and I feared, near death. When the Vet opened on Tuesday (after Labor Day) I took Lady Bug in to see what was wrong with her. She was running a fever of about 105 degrees, so the Vet gave her a shot of antibiotics and a prescription for more for me to give her orally.

Over the next week and a half, Lady Bug got better, her fever broke, but was still weak. Blood tests revealed that she had an infection of some type, but we don't know what was wrong with her. Before she got sick she weighed 63 pounds, but by today she has lost about 10% of her body weight. She has been eating again, but doesn't have much of an appetite. She is once again my shadow, but moves very slowly and is clearly not herself yet.

So, enough history. This afternoon, my 17 year old niece, one of her girlfriends, and my employee were doing some cleanup on my property so that my niece could bring in a horse. My neighbor's Pit Bull mix charged them, unprovoked, while they were on my property. My employee removed his belt, and started swinging it at the Pit Bull mix to ward it off. Lady Bug saw the Pit Bull attack, and came to the rescue. In her weakened state, she was no match, but she knew her duty.

I was in the shop when I heard hollering, screaming, and all hell brake loose. I came running as fast as and old, fat, out of shape man could. When I rounded the corner, I saw Lady Bug on the ground and the Pit Bull mix on top of her, trying to shred her to bits. I knew that when I hit the Pit Bull full speed with my foot, that I would knock it off Lady Bug. I was wrong.

The Pit Bull didn't release it's death grip, so my next instinct was to pull my pistol and shoot the aggressor. But instead, I hit the Pit on it's head thinking that would work - nope. Next I grabbed the Pit's leather collar and tried to pull it off Lady Bug, but all that did was pick up the Pit and Lady Bug, as the Pit had it's jaws clamped on Lady Bug's throat. I then noticed that the Pit also had a chain collar, so I grabbed the chain, twisted it, and hoped I could choke the Pit enough that it would have to release it's grip. Just as I was about to give up and was reaching for my pistol, the Pit finally succumbed to the choke down and released it's grip.

As they carried Lady Bug away, I held the Pit in the choke hold so everyone could retreat. The Pit looked me in the eye, Lady Bug's blood dripping from it's mouth, and the only thing I saw in it's eyes was pure evil. It was all I could do to fight the urge to destroy this beast. But in the end, I love animals, have trained to pull my CC weapon only as a last resort, so I released my choke hold and let the Pit retreat to it's own property.

Well, it's taken me well over an hour to type this, as I stop frequently to comfort Lady Bug, to hold the water bowl so she can drink, to reach for another Kleenex, and to try to regain my composure. I know not whether Lady Bug will live, I have preyed so, but fear the worst. She has not moved from her bed since we returned from the Vet about 10 hours ago, but at least she is drinking some water.

So, let's talk about Pit Bulls. I always thought that Pit Bulls got a bad rap and it was the owner's fault if they were mean and aggressive. But my neighbors are just ordinary people. They are like 60 years old. They are not criminals or drug dealers. They just happened to own a Pit Bull mix.

So what do I think about Pit Bulls? I say to hell with them. My employee tells me that before I got to the scene, the Pit had Lady Bug by the throat and was throwing her around like a rag doll. Had I been there and seen this happen, New Mexico would have one less Pit Bull to worry about.

Sorry to hear that James, I hope your Lady Bug pulls through.

On the main topic though, I witnessed the same thing with a beagle, so to hell with all beagles.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by falchunt

Sorry to hear that James, I hope your Lady Bug pulls through...

---

She's doing better, thank you.

Quote:

---

On the main topic though, I witnessed the same thing with a beagle, so to hell with all beagles

---

Yea, I hear you.

I mean, has there ever been a more vicious dog than Snoopy?

Now, back to the "main topic". Just for grins, what happens with you poll if everywhere you see the word "Dog", you substitute "Snake", and every where you see the words "Pit Bull", you substitute the words "Rattle Snake"?

The ignorance on the issue is by fa one of the most ridiculous. I personally own 4 2 of which stay in the house and our big babies. The breed was originally bred to fight and in this process aggression towards humans was bred out. So as records show pit bulls are less likely to bite a human than pomeranians. For example which are in the top ten for most human aggressive dogs. OK here it is for you all
There is a Dog Statistics done on every dog each year that shows what dogs are more aggresive than others. Don't believe me look it up. Atts - Amercian Temperament Test Society
Anything above 80% is good!!!!:smt023
Dalmation 81.8%, Husky 86.6%, German Shepard/ cop dog 83.5%, Rotts
82.6%, Mastiff 83.9%, American Pit Bull Terrier 84.3%, American Staffordshire 83.4%, Staffordshire Bull Terrier 85.3%, and Boxer 84.3

Now the beloved little dogs..:smt076
Collie 53.3%, Bichon Frise 79.3%, Corgi 75.4%, Chihuahua 70.3%,
Dachshund 70.2%, Setter 75%, Schnauzer 75.5%, Lhasa Apso 69.2%

So you see that beloved dogs are more human aggressive than the dangerous pit bull!!!:numbchuck:

Sorry James I understand your point but I had a lab kill one of my pits when he was 4 months old the lab was 2 years old got out the neighbors yard. I'm not saying that some pits aren't dag agressive, but they're not likely to be human aggressive so before we judge the breed and say kill'em all lets first get rid of the mean breds such as Collie 53.3%, Bichon Frise 79.3%, Corgi 75.4%, Chihuahua 70.3%,
Dachshund 70.2%, Setter 75%, Schnauzer 75.5%, Lhasa Apso 69.2%
Just to name a few!!!

James,
For the record, I was not being sarcastic when I was talking about the beagle. Actually, the beagle was my grandfathers. He is a fantastic rabbit hunting dog. Built like a tank, and has a nose like no other. He absolutely will not tolerate any other animals being on my Grandfather's property. He killed a black lab (stray) back in 01. He also attacked my mothers' toy collie, puncturing her rib area several times before I got there and pulled him off. The point is, what happend to your dog (glad to hear shes doing better) does not make any breed bad. Just makes a dog dangerous. And TimothyS is putting up some real facts on this page.

Alright, breaking out the stats...here's the CDC's reports on human dog bite related fatalities:
http://www.cdc.gov/ncipc/duip/dogbreeds.pdf

Summary of the totals from 1979-1999, excluding "police dogs at work" as indicated in the report (which would skew the data towards Dobermanns, I assume).

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by CDC

Pit bull-type: 66
Rottweiler: 39
German Shepherd Dog: 17
Husky-type: 15
Malamute: 12
Doberman Pinscher: 9
Chow Chow: 8
Great Dane: 7
Saint Bernard: 7

---

Also from the report:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by CDC

Studies indicate that pit bull-type dogs were involved in approximately a third of human DBRF [edit: dog bite related fatality] reported during the 12-year period from 1981 through 1992, and Rottweilers were responsible for about half of human DBRF reported during the 4 years from 1993 through 1996.

---

Basically, I think the conclusion that can be reached from this data and Timothy's is that small dogs are more likely to bite. However, given a bite, pit-bulls, rottweilers, and other large breeds are more likely to kill you.

KG

I see CDC facts which are ten years old, but as you stated pitbull types. Thats where the media causes the problems they include any dog thats in the bully breed or looks like a pit such as blocky head. So your CDC report maybe fact however it includes way more than pit bulls. I agree with KG but working in a field(I check electric meters on properties of all kinds) where dogs attack you for coming in their territory. I've never been bit by a pit or rott and I've been bitten 12 times. However I've got a scare on my ankle from a collie, was bit 2 times by a beagle mix, 1 saint bernard, 1 shepherd, 1 basset hound,and others that where mix breeds. My wife has a small scare on her face from her mothers Pomeranian.


EVERYONE SHOULD WATCH THIS!!!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6tzbgvIL2Iw

http://www.pitbulllovers.com

Ten Facts About Pit Bulls Every One Should Know
1. Pit Bulls are commonly used as therapy dogs. Whether they are visiting a senior care facility or helping someone recover from an emotional accident, Pit Bulls are making a mark as outstanding therapy dogs.

2. Pit Bulls are used in Search and Rescue work. One example of well known SAR Pit Bulls is Kris Crawford and her dogs. Kris and her dogs have helped save the lives of many people during their efforts. http://www.ForPitsSake.org

3. Pit Bulls serve as narcotic and bomb sniffing dogs. One Pit Bull, Popsicle (named that because he was found in an old freezer) has the largest recorded single drug find in Texas history. Read more about Popsicle here. Including how he found over 3,000 lbs of cocaine in Hildago, Texas.

4. Pit Bulls are great with kids. They weren't referred to as the "nanny's dog" for nothing that's for sure.

5. Pit Bulls are not human aggressive. The American Pit Bull Terrier as a breed is not human aggressive. In fact, quite the opposite is true of the breed. They are gentle and loving dogs. Like any dog individuals can be unsound and have behavior problems.

6. The Pit Bull was so popular in the early 1900's they were our mascot not only in World War One, but World War Two as well. They were featured on recruiting and propoganda posters during this time period.

7. Sgt. Stubby. A Pit Bull war hero. Stubby was wounded in action twice, he saved his entire platoon by warning them of a poison gas attack and he single handedly captured a German spy.

8. Pete the Pup on the orginal Little Rascals was a Pit Bull.

9. Pit Bulls score an 83.4% passing rate with the American Temperament Test Society. That's better than the popular Border Collie (a breed who scores 79.6%). View the ATTS stats here.

10. They are dogs not killing machines.

Why are they called Pit Bulls...?
:watching:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by js

Why are they called Pit Bulls...?
:watching:

---

Is this a test of peoples' Google-Fu? :numbchuck:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Todd

Is this a test of peoples' Google-Fu? :numbchuck:

---

well, my Golden Retriever has the name "Retriever" because it's in his genetics to retrieve. He was created for that purpose through breeding. He pretty much walks around 24/7 with a red ball in his mouth just waiting for someone to throw it so he can go and get it...then drop it at your feet to repeat the process. The "Shepherd" breed are bred to help herd... Poodles are water dogs, Mastiff's are bred to protect... Pointers point... yada, yada, yada... I'm just curious as to why a "Pit Bull" has the name of "Pit Bull". :-)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by TimothyS

I see CDC facts which are ten years old, but as you stated pitbull types.

---

Are you claiming that dog behavior has changed in the past ten years? :watching:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by TimothyS

I've never been bit by a pit or rott and I've been bitten 12 times.

---

If you followed the point I was trying to make, you'd realize the above statement is one possible reason you're posting on this board instead of pushing up daisies. I'm not saying pit bulls are more likely to attack, as you continue to try to refute, but that they are a fundamentally more dangerous dog because of the harm when they do attack.

To try to provide another example, I spend a lot of time walking around on a college campus, and I'm far more likely to get run over by a student on a bicycle than by one of the semi trucks that stops by every so often. I got hit just the other day by a yahoo on a bike, in fact. However, if you asked whether I considered the bikes or the semis more dangerous, I'm going to answer "semi" every time. Why? Not because I'm more likely to get hit, which isn't true, but because if I do get hit by a truck, I'm going to be a grease spot on the street.

Same deal with the small dog/pit bull argument. You could show stats that say a toy poodle is 100 times more likely to bite than a pit bull, but virtually no one is going to die from a vicious toy poodle. A pit bull, on the other hand, is quite large and muscular enough to kill anyone younger than a teenager or anyone is handicapped in some other way against an attack.

In my book, this is what makes pit bulls and the like "a more dangerous breed".

KG

Hmmm...I was police trained in my younger days because I was stalked once. The police people whom I had a good relationship with at the station near my work gave me a Rottweiler/German Shepherd X when I approached them for protection. Since then I have always have to have a Rottweiler or a Rottie/GS around me, not for so much for protection now but because of their temperament -- they are loyal and protective...and intuitive and loves training. I've lost two Rotties last year for health reasons. Picked up another one -- a Texas Rottie, tail intact, very babyish...still a baby up to now even at over a 100 lbs. I train him and he goes to training class for socialization. Never attacked anyone but will lick people who comes near him to death, I suppose...

Now my son in Melbourne (Australia) has a pure-bred pitbull. He wasn't trained but he is trainable. I go home as much as I can and first time we (pitbull and me) met, I find his jumping very irritable so for that two weeks, I trained him to sit everytime -- you know, the usual sit before going out of the door, sit before coming in, sit when he wants to jump at me, etc. He caught on very quick. Sonny boy told me he bought this pitbull because he was intrigue by the breed. He gets to be too much sometimes but he is OK with me and my husband when we are home there...we constantly teach him anything and play with him. My son caught on later on because we have to go back home here in the US and he will have to grin and bear his dog's behavior. Three weeks ago when I went back home to Melbourne, he frustratedly said to me that he wished he just bought a Rottie. I told him it does not matter what sort of breed he has, it will still behave the way he let it. Training is the key.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by js

well, my Golden Retriever has the name "Retriever" because it's in his genetics to retrieve. He was created for that purpose through breeding. He pretty much walks around 24/7 with a red ball in his mouth just waiting for someone to throw it so he can go and get it...then drop it at your feet to repeat the process. The "Shepherd" breed are bred to help herd... Poodles are water dogs, Mastiff's are bred to protect... Pointers point... yada, yada, yada... I'm just curious as to why a "Pit Bull" has the name of "Pit Bull". :-)

---

Damn, now I really miss my Golden. I gotta get another someday soon. Time to start working on the "boss".

IIRC, one of their purposes waaaaaay back was to either herd or fight bulls. I have no idea where the "Pit" part comes from. Now I must research!

Do you really not know where the name came from js?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by falchunt

Do you really not know where the name came from js?

---

I'm being sarcastic... but if someone wants a little history lesson, it's provided below...

Quote:

---

American Pit Bull Terrier

The American Pit Bull Terrier is the product of interbreeding between terriers and a now-extinct breed of bulldogs to produce a dog that combined the gameness of the terrier with the strength and athleticism of the bulldog. These dogs were initially bred in England, Ireland, and Scotland, and arrived in the United States with immigrants from these countries. In the United States these dogs were used as catch dogs for semi-wild cattle and hogs, to hunt, to drive livestock, and as family companions; however, some were selectively bred for their fighting prowess, and starting in the early 20th century they began to replace the bull terrier as the "dog of choice" for dog fighting in the United States.

The United Kennel Club (UKC) was the first registry to recognize the American Pit Bull Terrier. UKC founder C. Z. Bennett assigned UKC registration number 1 to his own dog, Bennett’s Ring, as an American Pit Bull Terrier in 1898.

American pit bull terriers today successfully fill the role of companion dog, police dog, and therapy dog; however, American pit bull terriers in general have a higher tendency towards dog aggression and constitute the majority of dogs used for illegal dog fighting in the United States. The fighting reputation of pit bull-type dogs led the San Francisco Society for the Prevention of Cruelty to Animals in 1996 to relabel pit bull terriers as "St. Francis Terriers" (not to be confused with the "Terrier" mascot of St. Francis College in New York) so that they might be more readily adopted; 60 temperament-screened dogs were adopted until the program was halted after several of the newly adopted dogs killed cats. The New York City Center for Animal Care and Control tried a similar approach in 2004 by relabeling their pit bull terriers as "New Yorkies," but dropped the idea in the face of overwhelming public opposition.

---

Let's re-cap: American pit bull terriers in general have a higher tendency towards dog aggression and constitute the majority of dogs used for illegal dog fighting in the United States

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by js

...Let's re-cap: American pit bull terriers in general have a higher tendency towards dog aggression and constitute the majority of dogs used for illegal dog fighting in the United States

---

But that's only because the Killer Beagle has long been outlawed - by International Treaty, I forget which one - from dog fighting. The Killer Beagle goes through Pit Bulls like a Killer Bunny goes through Knights.

Its how they are raised in my opinion. My dad had a mean ass border collie, that hated kids since the day we got him. Turned out the people we bought him from had a son who teased him and thatw as all he wrote.. Im more a a Rottweiller mastiff type guy myself.. Big somebeach's ..LOL

My brother has a pit bull and that is the most docile dog I have ever met. It's a little girl and she doesn't have an aggressive bone in her body. She is stout as an ox but sweet as an angel. I really do think it has to do with the environment a dog lives in. Even if a dog is born with aggression it is up to the owner how to control it.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by James NM

Pit Bulls. Well let's see.

It's about Midnight here in New Mexico on a Saturday night. I'm sitting in my office with my best friend since Sept '01. Lady Bug is a Lab mix that I rescued from a bad home/environment when she was about two years old. I have been a dog owner/lover for about 45 years, and I can say without reservation that Lady Bug is the best dog I have ever known, and I've owned a lot. I own my own business, and this has allowed Lady Bug and I to spend almost every minute of every day together for the last eight years. She has literally been my shadow - where I go, my shadow follows.

Over Labor Day weekend, (two weeks ago) Lady Bug got deathly ill, could not/would not eat, was throwing up, and I feared, near death. When the Vet opened on Tuesday (after Labor Day) I took Lady Bug in to see what was wrong with her. She was running a fever of about 105 degrees, so the Vet gave her a shot of antibiotics and a prescription for more for me to give her orally.

Over the next week and a half, Lady Bug got better, her fever broke, but was still weak. Blood tests revealed that she had an infection of some type, but we don't know what was wrong with her. Before she got sick she weighed 63 pounds, but by today she has lost about 10% of her body weight. She has been eating again, but doesn't have much of an appetite. She is once again my shadow, but moves very slowly and is clearly not herself yet.

So, enough history. This afternoon, my 17 year old niece, one of her girlfriends, and my employee were doing some cleanup on my property so that my niece could bring in a horse. My neighbor's Pit Bull mix charged them, unprovoked, while they were on my property. My employee removed his belt, and started swinging it at the Pit Bull mix to ward it off. Lady Bug saw the Pit Bull attack, and came to the rescue. In her weakened state, she was no match, but she knew her duty.

I was in the shop when I heard hollering, screaming, and all hell brake loose. I came running as fast as and old, fat, out of shape man could. When I rounded the corner, I saw Lady Bug on the ground and the Pit Bull mix on top of her, trying to shred her to bits. I knew that when I hit the Pit Bull full speed with my foot, that I would knock it off Lady Bug. I was wrong.

The Pit Bull didn't release it's death grip, so my next instinct was to pull my pistol and shoot the aggressor. But instead, I hit the Pit on it's head thinking that would work - nope. Next I grabbed the Pit's leather collar and tried to pull it off Lady Bug, but all that did was pick up the Pit and Lady Bug, as the Pit had it's jaws clamped on Lady Bug's throat. I then noticed that the Pit also had a chain collar, so I grabbed the chain, twisted it, and hoped I could choke the Pit enough that it would have to release it's grip. Just as I was about to give up and was reaching for my pistol, the Pit finally succumbed to the choke down and released it's grip.

As they carried Lady Bug away, I held the Pit in the choke hold so everyone could retreat. The Pit looked me in the eye, Lady Bug's blood dripping from it's mouth, and the only thing I saw in it's eyes was pure evil. It was all I could do to fight the urge to destroy this beast. But in the end, I love animals, have trained to pull my CC weapon only as a last resort, so I released my choke hold and let the Pit retreat to it's own property.

Well, it's taken me well over an hour to type this, as I stop frequently to comfort Lady Bug, to hold the water bowl so she can drink, to reach for another Kleenex, and to try to regain my composure. I know not whether Lady Bug will live, I have preyed so, but fear the worst. She has not moved from her bed since we returned from the Vet about 10 hours ago, but at least she is drinking some water.

So, let's talk about Pit Bulls. I always thought that Pit Bulls got a bad rap and it was the owner's fault if they were mean and aggressive. But my neighbors are just ordinary people. They are like 60 years old. They are not criminals or drug dealers. They just happened to own a Pit Bull mix.

So what do I think about Pit Bulls? I say to hell with them. My employee tells me that before I got to the scene, the Pit had Lady Bug by the throat and was throwing her around like a rag doll. Had I been there and seen this happen, New Mexico would have one less Pit Bull to worry about.

---

That is a horrible story, but I disagree with you that it isn't your neighbors' fault. If you own a dog, you have to train it.

I got a pit bull 2 years ago because I have always been afraid of them. I was 20 at the time, and went to the SPCA to get one as young as I could. I figured that if I trained one, I would fall in love with the breed. I was right.

She was stubborn as a mule when I got her, and 5 months old, 50 lbs. Luckily, I'm a pretty big guy, so I could handle her trying to throw her weight around. Now she's 75-80, and it'd be hard to train her if she didn't already respect me. I have never hit my dog, I don't believe in it, especially one that I get from a shelter. But she does respect me, because I spent months training her to be the dog I wanted her to be. Very few people so this nowadays, everyone expects a dog to just behave.

I have heard stories like yours with a bunch of breeds. I'm sure the dog had a bunch of pent-up energy and aggression because they wouldn't give it the excercise it needs. Pit bulls are very active and need at least an hour of excercise a day, or they will be trouble makers.

My dog is at the point where if she is gettig attacked at the dog park, I can say no, and she will run to my side with the dog biting her. I have use her to help train a friend's aggressive dog, because I know she won't react to the other dog as long as she knows that I am in control of the situation.

Also, ask anyone who has met her, she is the sweetest dog ever. She just wants to be a lap dog, even though she's pushing 80 lbs.

I stand by my opinion that it is the owner and not the dog. My neighbor's 100 lb German shepherd attacked my dog once, and she just peed when she saw him coming. Literally squatted and peed. She can sound like a mean dog from behind a fence, but I appreciate that, because she's protecting me. She will growl and get tense if she hears something outside, but if I show her that I'm okay, then she chills back out. I'm proud to have her as a first line of defense in my house, and I'm also proud that if she is outside, I don't have to watch her because I know how good she is with everyone and all breeds of dogs.

Because of the constant training I give her, she is the best dog anyone could hope for. But it took a lot of work, not just sitting there hoping she'll "grow out of it", which is what most people do.