Re: .45 ACP or 9mm
^^^ thanks. I have pretty much decided on the xdm9, and leaving towards the full size, but the compact is still interesting. I could buy more of the large mags, but I'm not sure about the shorter barrel, especially since I will not be carrying this gun. I may want to carry in the future, but I don't have a permit yet. I was sorta planning on buying a different carry gun if/when that happens (maybe a .45 at that point)
Fishwiz4. You have officially entered into one of the greatest and long running debates in firearms history, the 9mm vs. .45.
There are two basic schools of thought in regards to this. Those that feel the slower, heavier bullet is the best and those that feel the faster, light bullet is king. This has gone back and forth for years.
The .45's reputation for a manstopper is long lived. There have been studies, statistics, cows shot, ballistic gel shot by the ton and the hits keep on coming. The 9mm got a bad reputation in regards to stopping power and the same tests and studies were conducted. It all comes down to a few basic things.
Modern 9mm defensive ammo has come a long way. Better and heavier bullets and so on. The .45 trend has gone the other way with bullet weights getting lighter and faster. To me it all comes down to your ability to place the shot where you want it and need it to go. Generally speaking this is easier to do with a 9mm. The trend lately has been to build the smallest gun in the biggest caliber. They are meant to be carried a lot and shot a little and this is not really a good thing. Just because you can stick a .500 S&W magnum in a snubnose revolver does not mean you should.
The choices you have mentioned are good ones. Personally I would stick to the full size guns for your first. Compact guns are great for concealment but again generally will not be as easy or accurate to shoot as their full size brothers due to their shorter sight radius and increased recoil.
Once you have mastered that then move on to something else. I carry a gun professionally in nasty places around the world. It has varied in models from Beretta, CZ-99's, Browning Hi Powers or Glocks but I have always carried a 9mm and have been restricted to ball ammunition due to international law and the simple availability to resupply but I have never felt under gunned or has it ever let me down.
I realize that the restrictions that I face will not be a concern with you you have to realize the myth of the one shot stop does not exist no matter what the caliber. You shoot and keep shooting until the threat stops doing what he was doing that made you shoot him in the first place...period. Whether this is one round or twenty nine.
As has been stated the 9mm is cheaper to shoot so that could/would lead to more rounds fired which would generally lead to better accuracy with your chosen firearm. The .45 ACP is a great round and they make great guns for the caliber and I own several but when home I normally grab a 9mm of some type to carry. On the other hand my dedicated home defense gun before I grab a rifle is an M&P .45 with extended mags, threaded barrel and a weapon mounted light.
It has nothing to with the caliber the gun shoots well for both my wife and I and is amazingly accurate. As has also been stated get some training on weapons manipulation, clearing malfunctions, reloading and so on. Many places offer "tactical" classes for the new shooter and cover everything from firearms safety to drawing and shooting from unconventional positions.
Keep us posted on what you get
I have been converted!
I used to champion the .45 ACP as the one and only effective fight stopper.
But arthritis has taken its toll, and I just can't do the .45 thing any more.
So now I am convinced that the very best way to stop a fight is to carefully place a .380 ACP hollow-point bullet into my opponent's head.
Thus my conversion to 9mm—9mm Short, that is.
Sorry to hear that, Steve. Sounds like your aim hasn't suffered.
Originally Posted by Steve M1911A1
Assuming that you're not joking, do you handload for the 380? My loading blocks are too thick for the little buggers.
Old age takes its toll.
However, I can still make from-the-holster 20-yard head shots, quickly and effectively...with the .380, that is.
Two seconds each, I think.
I no longer reload anything. I have enough handloaded .45 ACP and .30-'06 in stock to keep me supplied well into my 10th or 11th decade. I do still scrounge empties, when Jean and I practice, but I have no idea about what I'm going to do with them.
I have never reloaded .380 ACP, or, for that matter, any pistol cartridge other than .45 ACP. I don't have the tools, nor have I ever before had the need. But still, I scrounge empties. It must be either a mental illness or a function of my dotage.
I haven't used a loading block for more than 45 years. I didn't need one, since I've loaded everything on first a Lyman turret job, and then a Dillon progressive press.
(I full-length resized .30-'06 cases on a separate, one-stage press. From there, they went right into the Lyman or the Dillon.)
The ole art ritis is starting here also....an aquaintance and I were talking about it the other day...he pretty much shoots nothing but .45, and I shoot nothing but .40...........but we both carry .380.....we figure, if your going to shoot someone, why hurt yourself in the process
Scrounging brass can quicklly become an obsession. I have to force my self to look up when I'm at a range. Otherwise I spend my whole time looking for good, or even mediocre, brass.
I did an evaluation on an offender 6 or 7 years ago who was accused of murdering a man. He used a .380 on his victim. The victim died.
I guess .380's aren't as harmless as some suppose ...
Never argue with drunks or crazy people.
My choice for a gun that serves both as a sport pistol for range shooting and home defense is a S&W 357 Model 60 with 3 inch barrel. I use it as a 38 since IMHO it is too slight a gun for a steady diet of 357 rounds. However, it will take on 38 +P all day long and not beat you up. I thoroughly enjoy taking it to the range to shoot regular 38 rounds. You always have the option to load with 357 rounds. As a defense weapon a draw back may be the 5 round limit, but I also have a 9mm and 20 inch double barrel Before buying either of my hand guns I rented and tested many models of revolver and semi-autos before purchasing. Everyone will tell you whatever feels right for you is the right answer. Hard to argue that. Good luck and enjoy your time at the range. I sure do.
Re: .45 ACP or 9mm
I just thought I would let you all know that I "pulled the trigger" today and am the proud new owner of a xdm9. Just got the black one, a few boxes of ammo, and few targets. I can post pictures, but everyone knows what it looks like.
Thanks to all of you for helping this rookie make an informed choice!
Now I am I full fledged member of the site, and I look forward to getting to know you guys.
Very nice gun and you wont regret that purchase.Just get ready because you now have the bug-and your want list will grow the more you read here! Haha. I also personally think you made the right choice going 9mm as your first gun. As others have said,way cheaper to shoot and that translates to more time on the range.Have fun.
Originally Posted by Fishwiz4
What a silly thread.
9mm and .45 are like the same to me. I shot just as well and had the same amount of felt recoil (which is like NO RECOIL in both calibers) in my G30sf as my G17. The G17 was much cheaper to shoot though!
With a 9mm you can get 33 round clips, and I have one. Pretty sweet little thing. I sleep easy at night! lol
What a stupidly judgmental comment!
Originally Posted by jakeleinen1
Discussions and the exchange of information are never silly.
People who are so set in their way of thinking that they think that discussions are silly, are foolish and likely incapable of learning.
...And they're called magazines, not "clips." There is a difference, although you may find that silly.
Well Steve you beat me to it.
Jake I am glad you see no difference in recoil between the two guns but many people do. The .45 vs. 9mm debate has raged for decades and I think you will find that there will be a faster shot to shot recovery with a 9mm than with a .45.
Generally speaking the smaller the caliber and the bigger the gun the easier it is to shoot. Perceived/Felt recoil is different for everyone that is one of the reasons why companies offer so many different variations in size and caliber of their guns.
The OP made a good choice based on his needs and wants.
.45 ACP or 9mm
Personally Steve, I think we focus on this too much. Although as a response to the previous post, good idea.
Originally Posted by Steve M1911A1
My rant on clip/magazine:
Do we know what is meant? Yes
Have they been used interchangeably for years? Yes (even by manufacturers)
Are they technically the same? Nope
Does it really matter. Probably not
Kinda like we don't correct people for saying the MOTOR in their car is a V-8
Yeah thats why I said felt recoil in my response. With practice ultimately you can get as good with a .45 IMO as you can a 9mm. Thats probably why I don't feel a difference.
Originally Posted by tacman605
Niadhf, well put! Agree lol
I finally got to shoot my new XDM9 today. I really enjoyed it and had zero problems with the gun. It operated perfectly for all of the 250 rounds I put through it. It was my first time to the range near me. This range has a simple $20 fee and that gives you access whenever you want (it is outdoor and there are no lights so I assume it is closed after dark) they have 25yd, 50yd, 100yd, 200yd, 300yd and 500yd berms that have some basic structure for you to attach targets to, but it is pretty basic. each distance has its own 3 sided shelter with roof, so I could shoot there in the rain.
Anyway, I did not bring my own frame for my targets so I was forced to hang my targets 25yds away. That felt like a long ways away, especially for a novice shooter like myself. I will bring somthing next time so I can hang my target closer. I also brought a orange "rubber" target cube so I placed that about 15 yards in front of me and that was much better. I liked how the cube moves when you hit it so you konw you made a hit and it changes the next shot just a little.
I can tell I have alot to learn about how to shoot more accuratly. I was pretty dissapointed in my performance. I know our forum has alot of info about how to shoot competativly or tactically, but I have not found much on this site that talks about basics for a new shooter. Maybe I just missed it. Do you guys have any recomendations about where i should look for some basic technique improvments to improve accuracy?
And I was pleasanly surprised with the "power" of this weapon in my hands. I know I sarted this thread off with poorly chosen words about caliber, but I was afraid that a 9mm would feel like a toy when compared to a .40 or .45. This was not the case. It was louder than I expected. Deffinatly needed the hearing protection that I brought. The felt recoil was less but still quite significant and I think I can get on target again quicker than I could with the .40's that I have shot. So I am very pleased with my choice of 9mm.
Thank you all for steering me in the right direction!
Fishwiz4. Glad to hear that you picked up your gun and had the chance to shoot it.
To learn what the Fundamentals of marksmanship you can simply do a google search and you will get several results. Shooting is a lot like bowling or golf. You must complete the same fundamentals every time in order to get the required results. Grip, stance, breath control, trigger finger placement, trigger squeeze, sight alignment all come into play no matter what the distance. There are several good videos from Magpul, Massad Ayoob and others that demonstrate these things. Training classes from a good instructor is your best bet.
While learning to shoot take each shot an an individual act incorporating the fundamentals then increased speed will come from that.
Originally Posted by niadhf
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