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  1. #1
    AubieGirl is offline Junior Member
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    Post Just purchased my first gun & I don't love it...suggestions?

    Hello,

    I am new to this group & just purchased a Taurus PT-22 DAO (double action only) & I don't love it. I like the tip-up barrel & weight of it. Size is ok, I guess. I don't like the long & heavy trigger.

    I am a petite woman with very little upper body & hand strength plus I have tiny hands & weak wrists.

    I think I would like, if it exists, a small semi-auto gun with a tip-up barrel & single action. I want a tip-up barrel because it's difficult for me to rack most that I've tried. I've been able to rack a few but it wasn't pretty or quick. Single action because I think the trigger would be easier for me or maybe I could deal with a double action if the trigger was easier after the first shot.

    I do want a revolver either, with all that being said does anyone have a suggestion for me?

    Thanks so much,
    AubieGirl

  2. #2
    DJ Niner's Avatar
    DJ Niner is offline HGF Forum Moderator
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    Well, Beretta makes several pistols that work similarly to your Taurus, but they are double-action only for the first shot. After that, they stay cocked, and a lighter single-action trigger pull is used for all subsequent shots. The first one is a .22, very similar to your current handgun:

    Model 21 Bobcat

    and the second one is a bit larger, quite a bit thicker, and in .32 ACP caliber; but once again, you'll see the similarities between it and your Taurus:

    Model 3032 Tomcat

    Besides these, there aren't many other choices in the tip-up barrel autoloader category. Beretta used to make a larger .380 with that loading system and a DA/SA action style (the Cheetah), but is has been discontinued for a while now, and used ones are a bit expensive, but they are out there if you want to find one bad enough.

    Any others that I'm forgetting here, folks? Chime-in if you know any!
    "Placement is power" -- seen in an article by Stephen A. Camp
    (RIP, Mr. Camp; you will be remembered, and missed)

  3. #3
    AubieGirl is offline Junior Member
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    Thank you so much for responding, at the risk of sounding foolish/girlie how much lighter are the subsequent shots? Would you say half? I have gotten a little better with it but I'm still focusing all my energy on pulling the trigger instead of aiming. Do you know if the trigger lengths or the distance between the back of the gun & the trigger, on the guns you suggested are as long as it is on my Taurus? I know what I have is small, but for me to reach the trigger the gun rests on my thumb knuckle closest to my hand instead of where I think it should between my thumb & index finger.

    Thanks again,
    AubieGirl

  4. #4
    AubieGirl is offline Junior Member
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    BTW, I did look at those online earlier tonight & I do see the similarities between them.

  5. #5
    usmcj's Avatar
    usmcj is offline Member
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    If not an actual class, check with your local gun shop and see if they will recommend someone to assist you with your grip. With little experience or guidance, it's gonna be tough to self-diagnose. Stance, grip, and finger position on the trigger, will all contribute to your ability to use any firearm proficiently.

  6. #6
    chessail77's Avatar
    chessail77 is offline Senior Member
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    If possible look at a S&W shield ...it is semi-auto and has an excellent trigger ....racking slide would only be needed before carry with safety on....but excellent advice to get some training and help.....JJ

  7. #7
    skullfr's Avatar
    skullfr is offline Member
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    might also look at a CZ-82/83.I dont know about fitting your hand,but it is DA/SA and can be carried like a 1911 and the SA trigger pull is nice on mine.If carried in DA mode the first is a lil stiff.By being a steel frame it soaks up the recoil and makes it real manageable.

  8. #8
    berettabone is offline Banned
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    I don't know if this will help, but you may want to check out H&K P30.....it's not small, it doesn't have a tip up barrel, but you can adjust the grips....sa/da.....it's the only firearm that my wife has been able to rack the slide on, and she's handled quite a few...just a suggestion.

  9. #9
    AubieGirl is offline Junior Member
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    Hi berettabone,

    I read your recommendation last night to another lady & I did check out the H&K P30 but the price quoted was a little over a $1000 which is double my max budget. Does that price sound accurate to you?

    Thanks,
    AubieGirl

  10. #10
    AubieGirl is offline Junior Member
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    Thank you all for your great suggestions & trust me I am following up on each one. I have already asked my local gun shop about training classes & he did not know of any. I live in very rural AL & there's only one gun range & it's only open to public every other weekend. Good news is, I do live on alot of land so I can practice at home but I don't have the type of guidance that I'd like.

    Thanks,
    AubieGirl

  11. #11
    berettabone is offline Banned
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    It sounds like an average price, and, no, they aren't cheap....you can find them on line for less, you can find them used for $750+....you could try Armslist, and check out your area, maybe you can find something there.

  12. #12
    rex
    rex is offline Senior Member
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    Where does the trigger rest on your finger?It should be on the first pad between the tip and middle.It sounds like the DA trigger is causing you to roll your hand around to get alot of finger on it for the hard pull.

    The 2 Berettas are DA/SA,but you can cock it for the first shot giving you the light SA pull for every shot.Have you looked at a Ruger 22/45 or MKIII?They are SA only,but the bolt in the MKIII isn't hard to operate at all.I have never handled a 22/45 so I don't know about them.In general,the larger you go the easier the slide or bolt will work.The little guns need a heavy recoil spring to compensate for low weight in a small slide.22s work on the straight blowback principle,where the weight of the slide or bolt along with the recoil spring is what keeps the gun closed long enough for the bullet to leave and the gas pressure to drop to a safe level before it opens up.Otherwise you'd get a face full of hot expanding gas.With the exception of a few,the larger centerfire cartriges use a delayed blowback operation,where mechanically the barrel and slide stay locked together for 1/10-1/8" before opening up.

    I mentioned the larger Ruger because the bolt has alot of mass to it,so the spring doesn't need to be near as stiff as the little guns.If you can hold it nestled in the web of your hand and your 1st pad rests on the trigger,I think you'd like it.Not knowing how small your hands are really makes it hard,I've known a few dainty women so I'm having a hard time thinking on the small scale with ease of use physically.The MKIII may be heavy for you if it fits you though,so that may be an issue.The 22/45 has a plastic frame so it may be lighter,but both are going to be heavier than your Taurus or the Berettas.I bedlieve my old Ruger MKII (pre MKIII) had a trigger weight of high 4lbs,but in general a SA trigger will hover around 5lbs.Your Taurus for a comparison guess is probably running 12lbs on the conservitive side in DA,so you can see there's a large difference.

    Oh,you live in redneck territory too.Gun show.I would imagine someone you know has some knowledge of guns.Take them to a gun show and you will have access to just about every model available so you can hold them to see if they fit you well.Not having alot of shops around limits you from knowing what's available.

    The 'girlie' comment was funny.Hope some of this helps you and keep dry,we're going to be flooded if this keeps on like they say.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by AubieGirl View Post
    Hello,

    I am new to this group & just purchased a Taurus PT-22 DAO (double action only) & I don't love it. I like the tip-up barrel & weight of it. Size is ok, I guess. I don't like the long & heavy trigger.

    I am a petite woman with very little upper body & hand strength plus I have tiny hands & weak wrists.

    I think I would like, if it exists, a small semi-auto gun with a tip-up barrel & single action. I want a tip-up barrel because it's difficult for me to rack most that I've tried. I've been able to rack a few but it wasn't pretty or quick. Single action because I think the trigger would be easier for me or maybe I could deal with a double action if the trigger was easier after the first shot.

    I do want a revolver either, with all that being said does anyone have a suggestion for me?

    Thanks so much,
    AubieGirl
    Not to seem impertinent, but what other guns have you tried?
    A couple of things:
    Small pocket pistols in small calibers are harder to actuate the slides on that somewhat larger guns in more powerful calibers. Why? Your thinking, "that doesn't make any sense." Let me explain:
    Itty bitty little mouse guns chambered in .380 or less are most of the time designed as a straight blowback design. By this I mean that the force of the cartridge when fired is simply held back by spring pressure and the weight of the slide alone. Generally speaking this requires a very strong spring to perform this function safely. Then complicate things with a hard to hold, tiny little slide.
    Larger calibers are generally (though there are some notable exceptions) a delayed blowback design. Typically involving locking lugs and other such design details to hold the initial force of the cartridge firing and "delaying" the cycling of the slide. This delay comprises microseconds so it's not really noticeable to the shooter except as maybe being somewhat less harsh than the alternative. And of course, bigger guns are simply easier to grab hold of.

    Why the explanation? Because I wanted to justify my recommendation that you seek something larger that the itty bitty little pistol you currently seeking.
    If you haven't tried one, check into a Sig P238. Single action, locking breech design. Sounds like it would be right up your alley. If not that, or something similar, a compact (or possibly a sub compact) 9 mm of some sort.
    Also worth noting. Racking the slide on a semi-auto is less about outright strength than technique. My wife has been the recipient of multiple surgeries on her arms and wrists. So, she has some issues with arm and wrist strength. While not without some effort, she can cycle most slides without undue drama. Instead of trying to pull on the slide, try holding the slide and pushing with the gun. I know, it sounds stupid, but it makes a difference. I also strongly recommend you seek out a female firearms instructor. IMHO, good, targeted-to-your-needs training may open up all sorts of options for you.

  14. #14
    dondavis3's Avatar
    dondavis3 is offline Senior Member
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    1st go to a class & get properly trained.It's worth the drive to a near by town.

    I agree with the go a little bigger concept for you.

    I'd suggest a non steel gun (plastic gun).

    If you want small - I'd suggest looking at "compact" size guns.

    Here's a S&W Compact 9c



    There are other brands you can choose from if you do not care for S&W.

    This one has a safety and is fairly easy to rack the slide.

    Wish we lived close - I'd let you try several of my smaller guns.

    As suggested before if you live close to a city - call and find a range that rents guns - make sure they have small guns to rent.

    But do your research and it's best if you decide on a gun .

    Getting suggestions is good.

    But too many people are biased and want you to buy "their" gun.

    Quality brands that are easy to find are S&W - Sig Sauer - Ruger - and many others.

    IMHO I'd rather buy a "used" high quality brand gun - than a "new" lower brand gun.

    I hope this helps.

  15. #15
    skullfr's Avatar
    skullfr is offline Member
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    You also may try contacting the local PD and see if they know anyone that can train you.My PD held my CHL class and offer basic skills courses.And they are correct about the gun shows being a great place for deals along with pawn shops.Just remember to take someone who is knowledgable.There are good deals if you know how to shop for them.

    ROLL TIDE!!!

  16. #16
    AubieGirl is offline Junior Member
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    Today was my second time firing it & I shot about 50 rounds. The heavy trigger wasn't as much of a struggle as it was on Friday. The first 2 & half clips were great, I felt more confident & at ease then fatigue set in & it was fire/jam/fire/jam/fire/jam & I know it was all me because my brother would clear the jam & fire the rest of the clip without any jams then I'd jam it again. By the end of the day, I did realize the difference in what I was doing when it jammed reverses not jamming so I feel like I made some progress today.

    When I purchased it, my thought was it's a starter gun...something to learn with then upgrade to something bigger/intimidating like my local gun shop owner wants for me.

    You guys have given me some great advice so please keep it coming. I am learning so much & this will make my next gun purchase much easier for me.

    Thanks,
    AubieGirl

  17. #17
    AubieGirl is offline Junior Member
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    Thank you so much for your response. To place my gun in the web of my hand I can only get the very tip of finger on the trigger so you are right I am rolling my hand around to get more finger on it.

    The night I bought my PT-22, my brother finally showed me the rugers you mentioned in a catalog. I have since looked them up online & I would probably have to get the 22/45 Lite because I don't think I could hold 3+ lbs steady enough right now. But I haven't actually held one either.

    Thanks so much for telling the trigger weight of my Taurus, it's not listed on their spec sheet so I was going to email them to find for comparisions sake.

    LOL yes I do live in redneckville, USA & yes there are a lot of guys around here that are self-proclaimed experts & they all have their favorites but a lot of their recommendations are conflicting too. Although, my brother seems to have more knowledge than I had originally given him credit for. Maybe he will to go to a gun show with me because there weren't many options available in store for me to actually hold & get a feel for.

    Thanks again, you have helped me tremedously!

    Good luck with the hurricane, I'm in NE AL so maybe all we will get is some much needed rain.

    AubieGirl


    Quote Originally Posted by rex View Post
    Where does the trigger rest on your finger?It should be on the first pad between the tip and middle.It sounds like the DA trigger is causing you to roll your hand around to get alot of finger on it for the hard pull.

    The 2 Berettas are DA/SA,but you can cock it for the first shot giving you the light SA pull for every shot.Have you looked at a Ruger 22/45 or MKIII?They are SA only,but the bolt in the MKIII isn't hard to operate at all.I have never handled a 22/45 so I don't know about them.In general,the larger you go the easier the slide or bolt will work.The little guns need a heavy recoil spring to compensate for low weight in a small slide.22s work on the straight blowback principle,where the weight of the slide or bolt along with the recoil spring is what keeps the gun closed long enough for the bullet to leave and the gas pressure to drop to a safe level before it opens up.Otherwise you'd get a face full of hot expanding gas.With the exception of a few,the larger centerfire cartriges use a delayed blowback operation,where mechanically the barrel and slide stay locked together for 1/10-1/8" before opening up.

    I mentioned the larger Ruger because the bolt has alot of mass to it,so the spring doesn't need to be near as stiff as the little guns.If you can hold it nestled in the web of your hand and your 1st pad rests on the trigger,I think you'd like it.Not knowing how small your hands are really makes it hard,I've known a few dainty women so I'm having a hard time thinking on the small scale with ease of use physically.The MKIII may be heavy for you if it fits you though,so that may be an issue.The 22/45 has a plastic frame so it may be lighter,but both are going to be heavier than your Taurus or the Berettas.I bedlieve my old Ruger MKII (pre MKIII) had a trigger weight of high 4lbs,but in general a SA trigger will hover around 5lbs.Your Taurus for a comparison guess is probably running 12lbs on the conservitive side in DA,so you can see there's a large difference.

    Oh,you live in redneck territory too.Gun show.I would imagine someone you know has some knowledge of guns.Take them to a gun show and you will have access to just about every model available so you can hold them to see if they fit you well.Not having alot of shops around limits you from knowing what's available.

    The 'girlie' comment was funny.Hope some of this helps you and keep dry,we're going to be flooded if this keeps on like they say.

  18. #18
    AubieGirl is offline Junior Member
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    Hi Overkill0084,

    I've tried a Ruger 45 revolver, Cobra 380, Glock 9mm, a 22 revolver & of course my Taurus PT-22. The 45 was WAY to much gun for me, I could not hold it steady & the recoil blew my hands above my head. I know Cobra isn't a great brand & the owner of it knows as well now. She was seduced by the shiny look & price. However, I couldn't rack it, was pretty loud & the recoil hurt my hand. Oddly enough (to me anyway) the Glock's recoil was nothing in comparison to the Cobra. They did have different types of handles/grips so maybe that was the difference??? idk I guess I should also say, I was initially told it was a Glock & now there seems to be some controversy over it, only thing we could agree on is that it's a 9mm. The 22 revolver was cake so I guess that's why I started there but I didn't realize there would so much difference in a revolver & semi-auto (please insert your jokes here lol)

    I have not tried a Sig P238 but I just looked it up online & you're right, it's definitely one I'd like to try. I like the size & weight of it but the trigger weight might still be more than I want. On my first trip to my local gun shop, he showed me a Taurus 380 Ultra-lite & I liked the feel of it but when I fired the other 380 which was twice as heavy & still had a killer recoil. I decided against the Ultra-Lite because I feared the recoil would be worse since it was so light, do you think my thought process was accurate?

    No, that's not stupid at all. I was showed that technique at the gun shop & was able to rack them but it wasn't pretty. Although, I do think I would improve with practice.

    Thank you so much for your response, you were very helpful!

    AubieGirl

    Quote Originally Posted by Overkill0084 View Post
    Not to seem impertinent, but what other guns have you tried?
    A couple of things:
    Small pocket pistols in small calibers are harder to actuate the slides on that somewhat larger guns in more powerful calibers. Why? Your thinking, "that doesn't make any sense." Let me explain:
    Itty bitty little mouse guns chambered in .380 or less are most of the time designed as a straight blowback design. By this I mean that the force of the cartridge when fired is simply held back by spring pressure and the weight of the slide alone. Generally speaking this requires a very strong spring to perform this function safely. Then complicate things with a hard to hold, tiny little slide.
    Larger calibers are generally (though there are some notable exceptions) a delayed blowback design. Typically involving locking lugs and other such design details to hold the initial force of the cartridge firing and "delaying" the cycling of the slide. This delay comprises microseconds so it's not really noticeable to the shooter except as maybe being somewhat less harsh than the alternative. And of course, bigger guns are simply easier to grab hold of.

    Why the explanation? Because I wanted to justify my recommendation that you seek something larger that the itty bitty little pistol you currently seeking.
    If you haven't tried one, check into a Sig P238. Single action, locking breech design. Sounds like it would be right up your alley. If not that, or something similar, a compact (or possibly a sub compact) 9 mm of some sort.
    Also worth noting. Racking the slide on a semi-auto is less about outright strength than technique. My wife has been the recipient of multiple surgeries on her arms and wrists. So, she has some issues with arm and wrist strength. While not without some effort, she can cycle most slides without undue drama. Instead of trying to pull on the slide, try holding the slide and pushing with the gun. I know, it sounds stupid, but it makes a difference. I also strongly recommend you seek out a female firearms instructor. IMHO, good, targeted-to-your-needs training may open up all sorts of options for you.

  19. #19
    AubieGirl is offline Junior Member
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    Hi DonDavis3,

    I would welcome a class & it's been suggested a couple of times here. So I'll look into it but so you all guys know a decent near by town is about 50 miles away. I really do live in the middle of no where lol.

    I personally don't have any favorite manufacturers yet so I am open to all them. I have looked at several of the top brands online. I just need to go to a gun show & get my tiny little hands on some of them.

    I wished I still lived in Dallas! I moved from Dallas in 2005 back to AL. I've lived in many places but the Big D has always been my favorite!

    I don't disagree with your new verses used theory however I don't trust my judgment to determine if it's a high quality gun or not.

    Thank you so much, you were very helpful!

    AubieGirl


    Quote Originally Posted by dondavis3 View Post
    1st go to a class & get properly trained.It's worth the drive to a near by town.

    I agree with the go a little bigger concept for you.

    I'd suggest a non steel gun (plastic gun).

    If you want small - I'd suggest looking at "compact" size guns.

    Here's a S&W Compact 9c



    There are other brands you can choose from if you do not care for S&W.

    This one has a safety and is fairly easy to rack the slide.

    Wish we lived close - I'd let you try several of my smaller guns.

    As suggested before if you live close to a city - call and find a range that rents guns - make sure they have small guns to rent.

    But do your research and it's best if you decide on a gun .

    Getting suggestions is good.

    But too many people are biased and want you to buy "their" gun.

    Quality brands that are easy to find are S&W - Sig Sauer - Ruger - and many others.

    IMHO I'd rather buy a "used" high quality brand gun - than a "new" lower brand gun.

    I hope this helps.

  20. #20
    AubieGirl is offline Junior Member
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    Thanks, I will do that & War Eagle!

    Quote Originally Posted by skullfr View Post
    You also may try contacting the local PD and see if they know anyone that can train you.My PD held my CHL class and offer basic skills courses.And they are correct about the gun shows being a great place for deals along with pawn shops.Just remember to take someone who is knowledgable.There are good deals if you know how to shop for them.

    ROLL TIDE!!!

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