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  1. #26
    manta's Avatar
    manta is offline Junior Member
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    Jul 2010
    N Ireland. UK.
    It wasn't a criticism. I was making the point that sometimes having a gun and be willing to use it is enough as was in your case. You could have being justified in shooting but you did the right thing a verbal warning and the sight of the gun was enough. The original post said that when you drew your gun negations were over. In a way you where still negation you just raised the anti and that was enough.

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  3. #27
    TedDeBearFrmHell's Avatar
    TedDeBearFrmHell is offline Senior Member
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    Jul 2011
    Quote Originally Posted by scooter View Post
    Are you positive? Go to walmart and wave it around and see what happens?

    I got curious and found this in Oregons firearms laws

    166.190 Pointing firearm at another; courts having jurisdiction over offense. Any person over the age of 12 years who, with or without malice, purposely points or aims any loaded or empty pistol, gun, revolver or other firearm, at or toward any other person within range of the firearm, except in self-defense, shall be fined upon conviction in any sum not less than $10 nor more than $500, or be imprisoned in the county jail not less than 10 days nor more than six months, or both. Justice courts have jurisdiction concurrent with the circuit court of the trial of violations of this section. When any person is charged before a justice court with violation of this section, the court shall, upon motion of the district attorney, at any time before trial, act as a committing magistrate, and if probable cause be established, hold such person to the grand jury. [Formerly 163.320]

    That pretty much looks like a brandishing law to me...written a little different than most but there it is........
    there is a difference between this law, which is POINTING a gun at someone and BRANDISHING which is anything from actually HOLDING the gun at a low ready to actually WAVING it about.

    close but no cigar my friend.

  4. #28
    SouthernBoy's Avatar
    SouthernBoy is online now Senior Member
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    Jun 2007
    Western Prince William County, Va
    Having to pull your sidearm is very likely to intimidate your assailant and cause him to take off running without you having to fire a shot, and that is fine. But the OP is correct. To carry a firearm with the mindset and deliberate intention of NOT having to use it but rather to [hope] cause your attacker to shiver in his shoes and turn to butter borders on absurdity. If you are not mentally prepared to use it, then the answer is quite simple... don't carry it.

    Regardless of what we may hear from armchair quarterbacks and pseudo heroes, unless someone has been in a similar situation, you will never really know how you're going to react when faced with an extreme encounter until it happens. Training, conditioning, and mental preparedness are your best friends to get you to the point of being ready to go the full distance should the need arise. But carrying a gun strictly and solely for the hope of intimidating an attacker is lunacy.

  5. #29
    Blade is offline Junior Member HGF Gold Member
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    Feb 2012
    St. Louis, MO
    In Missouri brandishing is defined as any display of a firearm in a provocative or threatening manner. So all someone has to do is answer yes to the question "Did you feel threatened?" and you may be found guilty of brandishing. In my opinion, and this is my opinion, not legal advice. I am NOT advising anyone to do anything. But in my opinion, my gun does not come out of its holster unless I intend to use it. Now, if as a result of drawing the gun, the bad guy bales, I'm obviously not going to shoot them in the back. I'm just saying I don't draw the gun until I feel the situation has reached the point where I need to use it. If that gun comes out, I want it to be clear to any idiot, that I had no other choice.

    For example, I'm in a parking lot and some guy gets hot saying I took his parking space. This happened recently. He approaches me in an openly treating manner saying he's going to beat the crap out of me. I retreated. I got back in my car and left the area. He didn't pursue, he just stood and yelled insults at me. I didn't care. Sacrificing a little bit of my pride, isn't worth getting in a situation where I have to explain why I shot someone. Now, had he pursued me, or cornered me where I had no retreat option, the rules change. By the way, I'm not a pushover. I played ice hockey for years, and have the broken teeth and scars to show for it. But now I'm a 58 year old guy with arthritis and bad knees. Standing toe to toe with a young, healthy, 250 lb guy is NOT an option. But even if it was even up, standing up to the guy when you are armed can cause problems. What if you begin to lose the fight? Can you use your gun then? You've already demonstrated a willingness to engage in violent activity. The courts have demonstrated time and again that an armed individual is held to a higher standard of restraint and behavior than an unarmed one. You KNOW the situation can escalate to the point where life may be lost. The other guy doesn't.

    And PLEASE do not construe this as criticism of anyone else's opinion, or actions in a given situation. Every situation is different. Every person is different. And no one can truly say what they would or wouldn't have done in a given situation until they've been through it. It's up to each person, as responsible individuals, to do what you think is best. You have to go with your gut and do what feels right to YOU.
    Last edited by Blade; 02-26-2012 at 10:30 AM.

  6. #30
    paratrooper is online now Senior Member
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    Feb 2012
    I don't go to gunshops as much as I used to, but I can't count the number of times I've heard a customer (or gunshop employee) mouth off about something totally wrong or ridiculous.

    At one point, a long time ago, I would have cared.

    Now? Not so much.

  7. #31
    capgun's Avatar
    capgun is offline Junior Member
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    Jan 2012
    Some mindsets regard weapons presentation as a challenge. Most times when men are killed by armed women their last words were "You ain't gonna shoot me!" just before they jumped in.

  8. #32
    FearNot is offline Junior Member
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    Feb 2012
    Quote Originally Posted by steve m1911a1 View Post
    the very best defense is situational and environmental awareness.
    That is, don't get into the fight in the first place.

    Your weapon is there only for use when all else fails.
    It is the last resort.

  9. #33
    SigmaBoy is offline Junior Member
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    Mar 2012
    Well said Blade. I'm like you and I've swallowed my pride quite a few times. Situations like a parking spot isn't worth a confrontation especially that we are armed. We are bigger men than them. My life's still at peace and that's the way I like it.

  10. #34
    Packard is offline Senior Member
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    Aug 2010
    Poughkeepsie, NY
    Quote Originally Posted by scooter View Post
    No BB NOT just if the other person sues you, In almost every state( actually I believe EVERY state) Brandishing a deadly weapon or exhibition of a deadly weapon is a CRIME (mostly misdemeanor) if it isnt followed up by an arrest or a justified shooting they can call the police and report it and off to jail you go.All they have to do is give an accurate description of the gun to prove they have seen it and you WILL be arrested, maybe it gets dropped later but that doesnt help you right then.
    In New York, I believe it is called "menacing". If they don't think you were a reall menace they will reduce it to "disturbing the peace". Either way, you lose your pistol license.

  11. #35
    zhurdan's Avatar
    zhurdan is offline Senior Member
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    Mar 2008
    Quote Originally Posted by manta View Post
    It wasn't a criticism. I was making the point that sometimes having a gun and be willing to use it is enough as was in your case. You could have being justified in shooting but you did the right thing a verbal warning and the sight of the gun was enough. The original post said that when you drew your gun negations were over. In a way you where still negation you just raised the anti and that was enough.
    The gun coming out is most DEFINITELY NOT part of the negotiation. Why? Because guns do not deploy instantaneously. When the situation dictates that you are at the point of no return, that doesn't mean the "shooty" part, it means the point at which you can still deploy your weapon. The "shooty" part is a separate decision.

    In other words, the situation is fluid and may change from when you decided that this is the point at which gun clears leather. Happened in my situation too. The situation was escalating, so I escalated my response. I wasn't negotiating with him, I was preparing to put a bullet between his eyes. I couldn't have deployed my gun if I'd waited until the "shooty" decision was made. He'd have been right on top of me and my brains would have probably been leaking from my ear.

    Once the gun was out, I hadn't decided to shoot, I was preparing to shoot because you can't shoot someone from your holster.

  12. #36
    multistage is offline Junior Member
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    Feb 2011
    You don't ever draw a weapon with the hope that you will scare an assailant. If you draw, it had by God better be YOU who is scared.

    Fake gun. Good Lord.

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