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  1. #1
    Old11Bravo is offline Junior Member
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    Ultra Carry II Nose Diving

    Nose Diving rds..Have this (bought new) Ultra Carry II 3", 400-600rds fired (185 & 230gr, FMJ, JHPs (Fed., Horn., Rem., Cor-Bon, ETC...

    The mags seem to be loose fitting, especially the Wilson & McCormick (mags for full size 1911!

    QUESTION: When locked to the rear, should the barrel/ramp be a little loose or free float??

    SO FAR: polished ramp & throat glass smooth, polished slide rails glass smooth (4000 grit paper), polished inside edges of bullet trap on mags (Wilson, McCormick, Kimber).

    Using Rem Oil (Teflon), Lucas Gun Oil, Hoppes Oil, Tetra Lube.

    Still getting "Nose dive / hang on ramp, "All Rds"

    Read lots of comments, tried the ones I am comfortable with, better but still not street carry confident.

    Vic

  2. #2
    Glock Doctor is offline Banned
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    Merry Christmas!

    Two things haven't been mentioned: (1) On what round does this nosediving occur? Top, middle, next to last - What? (It can make a difference.) (2) What magazine, or magazines, does this problem occur with? One, two, or all magazines?

    Internet gunsmithing is always hard; sometimes it's impossible to correctly diagnose a problem without actually holding the gun in your hands and examining it. This said, I'll take a shot. (Yes, that's a pun!)

    Sometimes polishing the feed ramp becomes more a part of the problem than part of the solution. (1) If there's too much of a, 'mirror shine' on some ramps a feeding problem will become exacerbated rather than solved. I've had guns where slightly roughing up the ramp with some extra-fine grit Emery cloth, along with a light coating of oil was all that was needed to finally straightened them out. (Too shiny a ramp - with too little friction between the bullet and the steel - actually gives a forward moving cartridge a choice of which direction it wants to head in.)

    That leaves two other possible causes: (2) The front angle on your magazine follower is too low; but, with more than one magazine involved, this might not be it. (3) There might be too much of a gap between the top of the magazine, and the top of the magazine well. (This is a magazine well, upper dimension problem from which thousands of Glock Model 36's once suffered; and, I'm sure, from which some of them still do.)

    How do you check for it? By inserting a small piece of heavy cardboard between the top of the magazine well, and the top of the magazine, itself. Shoot the pistol; and if the problem disappears then it's back to Kimber you have to go with the gun, and a full report. I hope it's something simple like only an upward adjustment on the front of the followers of only one or two magazines; but, via the Internet, it's impossible to know.

    Before you go any further than this I suggest you mark each of the magazines involved with something like a, 'magic marker'; (Gun solvent will take the marks off.) and pay careful attention to what particular round, 'in the stack' takes a dive. Keep notes, too, just in case you need to correspond with Kimber. (Who, probably, isn't going to be happy to see, or hear about, that polished ramp.)

    Best I can do for ya from within the depths of cyberspace!




    NOTE: Just re:read your post. Did you say, 'All rounds'? ALL ROUNDS FROM ALL OF THE MAGAZINES! Take the bright polish off the feed ramp; and you should be fine. Do this progressively, a little at a time. Stop. Fire the gun, and test to see if the nosediving has disappeared. Make a final stop when the problem goes away; and don't polish your feed ramp, again - OK.

    If this isn't it; (and, with a quality 1911 like a Kimber, I think that it is) then it's #3 above; and I've already told you what needs to be done, there, too.

  3. #3
    Old11Bravo is offline Junior Member
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    Thanks for your help, have a Merry Christmas & a Happy New Year, may Santa show up with a new 1911

  4. #4
    Steve M1911A1's Avatar
    Steve M1911A1 is offline Senior Member
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    Does your Kimber have a "two-piece" feed ramp? That is, is part of the feed ramp attached to the barrel, and the rest of it a part of the frame?
    If it has that "two-part" feed ramp, is there a small gap in the ramp when the slide is fully open, or do the two sections meet flush with one-another?

    If you have polished so well that you have made the two parts of the feed ramp meet flush with one-another, it is very likely that this is your problem.
    There has to be a small horizontal (not vertical) gap between the sections—maybe about 1/32"—for a 1911 clone to feed properly.

    Since I am not personally familiar with the pistol in your hands, please tell me about the arrangement of the feed ramp: two-piece (as described) or one-piece (part of the barrel).

  5. #5
    rex
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    Yes it's normal for the barrel to move a bit when linked down.

    The first round nose diving is normal,as you load the mag the gap between the bullets increase.If you download one or 2 rounds it should go away.

    There are 2 possibilities here and they are normally to due with being off spec:

    The first is an old Kimber trait,the feed ramp is shallow and at the wrong angle.If you look at the bottom of the ramp cut it should be at least to the bottom of the slidestop window,going off memory I believe .400" deep vertically.

    The second is either a low mag release or high cut in the mag,not normal for those mags but not impossible.Try pushing up on the mag as you load it,and if it does this every round keep pressure on the mag throughout the shot string.If this cures it EGW makes a mag release the holds the mag .020" higher to correct this situation.It shouldn't be needed but when everyone and their brother started making 1911s they deviated from pattern specs.Kimber was awefull about tis but they have tightened up a bit in the last few years.If pushing up on the mag does nothing,return it to Kimber to fix.Being a newer gun I would suspect it's more a release issue than an off spec ramp,but with Kimber you never know.

    I forgot,Kimber mags have issues,the mags you have are top of the line and rarely don't work.If Kimber says it's their mags causing it I would call BS unless those mags don't work in other 1911s.

    Another possibility is your release has worn,but highly unlikely unless you add a few 0s after your round count.

    Sorry,had to break for breakfast.

    Steve is right about the 1/32" gap,some will run without it but very few.If you just polished the ramp without altering it you didn't mess it up,1911s like a polished ramp to smooth out their rough chambering process.If you did get overzealous that could very well be the cause.Another place that likes to be polished is the breachface.Some aren't even flat,when they cut the second time from top to bottom they sometimes cut deeper than the initial facing,so the sides are slightly higher.You'll see the imprint on the fired case being a straight depression on the edge of the rim.

  6. #6
    Steve M1911A1's Avatar
    Steve M1911A1 is offline Senior Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by rex View Post
    ...Another place that likes to be polished is the breachface...
    ...Also the underside of the barrel hood.
    The incoming cartridge nose strikes it, and drags along it, as the cartridge slides into the chamber.

  7. #7
    rex
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    True,I've been fortunate enough to never need to but I've seen some rough ones.

  8. #8
    Old11Bravo is offline Junior Member
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    two piece, 1/32 gap, BUT last night I found a VERY SMALL bur on the bottom of the "Barrel Ramp" and polished it off with 2000 grit. Probably shoot it tomorrow, we'll see, let ya know

  9. #9
    Old11Bravo is offline Junior Member
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    I'm back,

    I guess the small barrel ramp bottom edge "Bur' was my problem, fired 100rds today (getting expense), 30rds FMJ, 30rds Hornady Zombie, & 30rds Rem Golden Saber & the last 10 were a mix of all three. NOT 1 FTE or FTF, I'm happy !!

  10. #10
    Steve M1911A1's Avatar
    Steve M1911A1 is offline Senior Member
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    As Shakespeare once wrote, "All's Well That Ends Well."

  11. #11
    rex
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    Kind of odd something up there would alleviate the problem,but if it works great.I was picturing the bullet nosing into the bottom of the frame ramp,that's a technical nosedive.It feeds now so you obviously got one with a decent extractor,if it feeds funny later on that's the first place to look,or if the last round doesn't eject.Go shoot her now,some Kimbers just need a couple hundred rounds for one of those break in things.

  12. #12
    Old11Bravo is offline Junior Member
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    Thanks gentlemen for your help and advice, I really appreciate it, watch your 360 & if it don't eat pork, kill it!

  13. #13
    Steve M1911A1's Avatar
    Steve M1911A1 is offline Senior Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by Old11Bravo View Post
    ...[I]f it don't eat pork, kill it!
    What?
    You're not kosher?
    Oy vey!


    (Islam is not the only religion which forbids pork.)

  14. #14
    Glock Doctor is offline Banned
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steve M1911A1 View Post
    ....... Islam is not the only religion which forbids pork.
    I was just thinking that! (Leviticus 11:7-8)

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