View Poll Results: Please Rate the Kahr PM9
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Too Many Problems for Concealed Carry with Hollow Points
Some reliability or other issues. Test fire a lot.
Normally good handguns, but special care needed or selected ammo
Disregard Dealer Comments, Few Problems, Most Ammo Works, Highly Recommended
You are gonna LOVE this gun!
Happened to this guy too: Kahr PM9 Kaboom | The Firearm Blog
I don't think it is too much gunpowder. This is a USAammo reload. When I put a bullet into the Kahr PM9 chamber, it exposes about 2mm more than the other barrel chambers I checked: FNX-9 and CZ 2075.
I truly think that the issue is that the brass casing is stressed during the initial firing, and would normally handle a reload firing as long as the chamber covers the casing up to the rim. But if just 2mm is exposed, it is enough to blow out the casing at the stress points near the rim.
But, checking with the Kahrtalk is a great idea.
The good news is that no one was injured and the gun survived. I field stripped the slide and reinserted the extractor. I will find out tonight if it works.
I think that is an excellent idea...for you.
Originally Posted by cclaxton
I own or have owned 4 Kahrs in 9mm, .40 S&W, and .45 ACP, and shot them all regularly using my hand loads. The only problems a hand loader should encounter would be from using un-jacketed lead bullets in the models with polygonal rifling...the same problem some have had with Glocks.
A properly sized and charged hand load, with a correct bullet and primer should not be any more or less safe than factory ammo. I go to extra trouble to make mine identical to factory ammo, as far as size and shape, and I have always assumed everyone else did the same.
Still can't explain why I have had this happen twice in my Kahr PM9 and once in another guys' Kahr PM9, but I have had zero problems with this ammo in other guns. It may be that some rounds have been twice fired before they were reloaded. Or, maybe some of the brass USA used was hand-loaded hot without them knowing, thus stressing the casing before they got it.
But I keep coming back to the fact that the Kahr does this and neither my FNX-9 nor my Cz 2075 have any problems with this reloaded ammo.
using factory reloads, you would have to, to be fair and accurate in your theroy, have fired those same rounds in other guns. Seeing that that is impossible I for one tend to think it was those specific round casings, not the PM9. Many Many Many millions of rounds have gone through PM9's and this is not a common nor a reoccuring problem at all. To find 2 incidents on the internet, easy to believe. How many times has this type of thing happened in other weapons. I don't have time or the inclanation to persue that information but I bet more then 2 times. You have talk to exhausting lengths on more then one forum how you are trying to find the cheapest rounds to buy and use. With the rsults you are posting and this type of thing I would be more concerned with reliable, quality rounds at a decnt value then what fraction of a cent can be saved only to put up with duds, stovepiped and casings splitting.
I have shot hand guns for many rounds now, close to 10,000 per year. I have never bought cheap greasy ammo other then WWB which is too dirty, and smokey for my taste. and I have never experianced the cornucopia of problems you report. I have the much the same guns as you also. Buy good ammo see if it happens, my money says it does not!
I have seen other reports of kabooms involving USA Ammo - on several other forums. I wouldn't use the stuff.
Originally Posted by cclaxton
Kahr CM9 is the best pocket gun dollar for dollar. More accurate than Glock and you are not packing a brick.
Since I have been using good ammo, I have put at least another 200 rounds through it and NO PROBLEMS. I used CCI Blazer Brass, USAammo Brass New, and Ruag Ammotec Zinc-coated Steel. I carry the gun IWB except where I can't (Office, etc.), and it is at my side at night, so it seems to be with me all the time. It really is GREAT for a carry gun: lightweight, easy to conceal, safe enough without safety, and stays pretty clean after use.
I do want to fire some more HP rounds through it to ensure its reliability with HP, but I do carry it with confidence.
Finding a way to carry an extra mag was challenging, but finally got a small enough mag holder for my belt.
If I could improve it, I would add a safety and give it a short, light trigger with short reset. (Would I then have a Beretta Nano?)
I don't think their junk many people own them--some LEO's use them. I think there tolerances are tight and the pistol needs to have a break in period.
My son talked me into buying a PM9. His has worked flawlessly and he carries it al the time. Mine had some FTF's after aobut 150 rounds. Nosedives. And, the magazines would not drop free when ejected. It is now back at the mother ship for diagnosis and treament. I expected a $600 gun to run like a Glock. "There is no doubt that the Kahr is more difficult to field strip and reassemble. It is also difficult (or Verbotten) to sling shot a round (makes a tap, rack, bang difficult to do)
My vote is for all the categories in the poll. If you are lucky, you get a great gun with functioning magazines. If not lucky it could be a POS.
Remember the rules with use of the Kahr PM9 and it will be reliable and a great carry gun and accurate:
1) Always use the mag release to release the slide, and never manually rack the slide;
2) Never put a magazine in the gun with the slide closed EXCEPT when you loaded a round in with no mag and hit the mag release.
3) Always use new ammo, no reloaded ammo.
4) Recommend always loading the gun how you will carry it. I carry with it in 7+1 mode. I do this by removing the mag, putting a bullet in the chamber, releasing the slide with the slide release, and then putting the full magazine in the gun. I never have a FTF if I do this procedure.
5) I use Fed Premium HST and Winchester Ranger.
6) You can use +P, but I don't recommend it. The gun is just too small for it.
I still carry my Kahr every day and practice with it every week.
Guns are like cars...gotta adjust to how to drive them.
Good Luck...stay away from reloads....trust me on this.
I owned a CM9. I really enjoyed pocket carrying tuhe firearm. The one mistake that made me an x Kahr owner was the after market night sights that Kahr installed kept breaking off. I will say Kahr customer service was excellent and they tried real hard to fix the problem. I am going to give the Beretta Nano a try.
I must have bought a lemon. I sold my Kahr after putting several hundred rounds through it, many of which failed to feed. The problem started right out of the box. The gun jammed, and upon breaking it down, I was shocked to see the slide had shaved several long slivers of polymer from the frame. Per my dealer's advice, I cleaned and lubed it, and tried again. It ran a little better, but was still unreliable with several kinds of ammo. I was assured it only needed breaking in.
It finally went back to the dealer, who said it was fine, and claimed it was my fault for limp-wristing it. This was after he kept it for 5 weeks. I have years of shooting experience, especially with small pocket guns, so it wasn't my fault. Others shot it and had the same problems.
It finally started to get better, but by then, the lack of trust had made it impossible for me to carry it. The seed of doubt was planted. I wanted to love this gun. I needed to love this gun. It felt good in my hand, it carried well in a pocket, not to mention the fact that I paid a fortune for it. It even looked cool.
But, and I'm sure this will be knocking the hornet's nest, I found this gun to be the biggest and most expensive piece of crap I have ever owned. The Edsel of handguns. I sold it to a guy I can't stand, at a loss. I couldn't sell it to someone I liked in good conscience. The whole thing left me out several hundred dollars in ammo and range time alone, let alone losing money on selling it.
Bottom line, if I can't get stone-cold reliability right out of the box, it goes bye-bye. I'm not trusting my life to something so unreliable.
It does need breaking in, you let go of a very fine firearm in my opinion... far from a piece of crap.
Did you follow the break-in procedure at Kahr's forum? Seems most of the issues people have are because they didn't break it in properly... Kahr makes a tight weapon, not a loose goose like a Glock or XD/XDM (I have an XDM, love it).
It's small, light, precision made, and a workhorse - you just have to spend a little time with it in some cases. Obviously this isn't for everyone, and definitely not for people who want a perfect gun out of the greasy box.
That said, I'm always glad to find a 'used' Kahr at the gun shop because I have a good feeling I know why it's there.
600 rounds + Continual Malfunctions= Piece Of Crap
Definitely a personal decision, and I'm by no means trying to fault you for yours... everyone has their own level of acceptance.
Did you give Kahr an opportunity to make it right, on their dime? Every manufacturer sends out a lemon now and then... that's what the warranty is for. How many Glock Gen 4 owners wrote their new gun off as a piece of crap vs giving Glock the opportunity to make it right with a new spring, for example.
It was gone five weeks, and still didn't work right. That was their opportunity to make it work. Or not. It was returned "or not".
I'm happy for those that have had great luck, but clearly, many haven't. The happy customers always seem to insinuate we didn't do enough or give the gun a fair shake.
Bottom line, I did, and still got burned. I still stand behind my belief that I would never be able to trust this gun to save my life. My peace of mind was gone, and nothing would bring that back. The damage was done.
I responded to an officer shot call, where the officer's gun failed and she only survived by drawing a backup gun and shooting her assailant. It was a big wake up call. My every day carry guns have both gone bang every single time I have fired them. The Kahr didn't. Which would you carry?
I'm not trying to be confrontational toward you, Thunder71. I try never to knock another guys old lady, his gun, or his pickup truck. But my experience was terrible. Glad yours was better.
My Kahr MK9 Elite has been a very good companion. It was tight when new but always functioned properly. It's broken in now and just as pleasant as ever, just easier to rack.
Maybe I'm one of the lucky ones but I've owned my PM9 since 2005 and when I tell you I have shot over 13K rounds thu it without incident I'm not kidding.
I think to be honest I've had one or two stove-pipes or jams since 05 but other than that this gun has been incredible and flawless is an understatement.
Now with that said when I was first looking at these due mainly beause of the size & weight I found numerous posts by people from different gun sights saying it was junk but I took my local gun dealer's word and he said " I love mine and if you don't like it I will buy it back for full price".
Well I know most people don't have a guarentee like that to fall back on so it was a no brainer to buy it and as of today, 7 years later I'm completely satisfied.
I owned a Kahr CM9 (low budget version of the PM9). In my opinion the magazine makes the gun a no go. I sent my gun back 3 times in 4 months and the nose dives would be a non issue in my opinion if Kahr would use the same supplier Beretta uses for their Nano when it comes to the magazine.
The whole magazine issue is very well documented at Kahrtalk.com but for what ever reason Kahr does not want to address the magazine short comings.
Sorry my Beretta Nano is a superior ccw over the Kahr CM9 beginning with the magazine.
My Kahr PM9 has been more dependable than my kimber pro raptor 1911 ..
And more concealable.
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