ive posted in many forums about guns im looking to purchase, usp9 being one of them. the general opinion is why spend the money for a usp when and m&p, glock, xdm, px4, and others can be had for hundreds less. but something still draws me to the usp but not sure im willing to spend 750ish for one. (i recently bought a glock, shopping for a 2nd gun) so, i guess im looking for opinions from hk owners as to why hk is worth the extra money.
My First ever handgun was a USP .45 . It is an awesome firearm, however it is just simply HUGE. I have small hands, and I could shoot it OK, but it was just too big for me. They are truly awesome pistols, but they are BIG and EXPENSIVE. American pistols are catching up in quality for the most part, and are doing pretty damn good as far as accuracy. If you get an HK, and it fits you, you will not be disappointed. If you get an American pistol of the same type (Polymer etc..) and it fits you, you will not be disappointed. There is something about an HK that is just plain "cool" though, and I do regret selling my USP .45
Well first I cannot knock any of the more common brands particularily the Glock, M&P or PX4. Largely I think it is about preference. In my opinion I think HK's are over built because of the 40 S&W cartridge that the USP was originally designed around. HD construction and you get the same beefy dimensions with a 9mm or 45 at less pressures. I like that. They are super strong and apt to last up to some very rough and extensive service. While manageable I find the full sized USP line to be a little big for me but the USPc, P2000, P2000SK, P30, HK45 and HK45c are all a good fit. I tend to look at these as more refined versions of the USP without sacrificing the core qualities. Personally I have settled primarily on the HK P2000 platform because it meets my personal criteria and works well for me. Are they worth it? To me absolutely but their are certainly other quality options out there.
Further food for thought, I believe that the list of handgun manufacturers who do not cut corners or have quality concerns with history proving it out is a small list indeed. HK is on that short list. Expensive? Compared to a Glock? Yes. Compared to a good 1911 or a Sig? No. Magazines expensive and sometimes hard to get? Yes and yes. USP, Expert and MK23 big beasts? Definately. Was customer service deplorable in the not so distant past? Yes. Do they ever waiver from making a top quality and consistant fire arm? No. They do what they do and they do it really well. That's all I ask. I must admit I have become an HK fan boy but only after I tried just about everything else first. Hope that helps and is just my opinion.
how is their customer service now? the poor service seems to be a big issue but nobody really says how they are now. and i have bigger hands so the usp fits decently, good enough not to spend the extra money for a p2000 or the other high end ones. and i found a couple websites that almost always has mags for them. http://www.hkparts.net i cant remember the other one right off hand....i just like the usp because its a big, ugly, and intimidating handgun, compared to many others. and hk are world renown for the products they make. so yea, compared to sigs and 1911's theyresonably priced. i never thought of that before.
Thanks for the link. MidwayUSA is another good resource I have found for magazines and other parts as well. I have never had to use HK customer service other than once for an accessory and it was quick and without incident factory direct. HK was once renowned for being standoffish with customers like you and I and infamous for treating stocking dealers such as our local gun shop or sporting goods store poorly in terms of product availability, product information and general support for them. In more recent history, and again this is based on what I have read and heard, customer service has improved considerably on both fronts. I believe HK has a US presence now and that might account for some of the improved after sale US support. I have noticed that accessories, such as flat flush magazine base plate pads, have become more plentiful and easier to come by than in years past. I swap them out on my P2000's.
I understand the point regarding price when compared to other polymers running in the 550 to 650 range but I consider HK's more of a hybrid. It's kind of like 1911's. You either get the advantages or you don't. USP cocked and locked/traditional DA/SA all in one model, 2 LEM variants, variants to accomodate various trigger options and RH or LH shooters and capable of handling the hottest ++P or 45 Super loads. Subtle touches like a rubberized boot infused to the hammer for ease of manual cocking and an oversized slide release easily operated by a lefty like me with my trigger finger. Very well thought out. Given the popularity of the newer models you should be able to score a good deal shopping around on a USP. $625 to $675 new. If you spot a good condition used one in the 500's I would give that serious consideration. I bought a lightly used P2000 9mm for about $585 and it would be the last of my small collection I'd part with. The focus of attention and the mark up seems to be on the P30 and HK45's right now. Great opportunity to sneak in the back door and score some of the out of vogue but just as good older models like the USP.
I've never shot one or owned one. I want one just from handling a P2000 at a recent gun show. I see it as Escalde instead of a standard Suburban.
Originally Posted by mr.goodkat
I've got a few H&K but not only H&K (mostly). I think they are worth a bit more the run of the mill pistol. I've had their products for many years, many rounds. I have never broken one or had a FTF/FTE yet. I don't always follow the warranty rules (I shoot lead, often). I do thoroughly clean them after each outing. They last, are accurate and hold their value. Even a well worn USP will bring $450-$500 at a show. A few of my friends are Glock fans... they paid less for the gun/mags but I've also know that they have replaced parts and have had them jamb in competition. The 1911 crowd have all had their guns FTF/FTE (even the $3k custom jobbers, like my brothers). H&K's are like Mercedes... There is something to be said about engineering, quality and craftsmanship. The gun is the investment. If you invest in crappy product expect a crappy return. Look at the H&K Expert.... IMO well worth the extra $(~$1k).
You have to get what fits your hand. You are going to be defending your life with what is in that hand! I prefer to bet on what has demonstrated reliability over the years.
Look at other guns too. I like CZ75(9mm/.40) or CZ85(9mm) or CZ97(.45) or CZTS(.40). Many local ranges have guns to rent.... spend $50 and rent a bunch and see what you like.
CDNNinvestments. just sent out an e' flier USP .45 compact or reg... $699 Thats a pretty good deal!
Last edited by H&K-nut; 03-28-2010 at 05:19 PM.
Reason: new info
Originally Posted by mr.goodkat
This might be a good reason:
P30 Thursday: Week Forty-Two
From 1-May-09 to 19-Mar-10 — 322 days — the pistol fired 91,322 rounds.
Of those 322, it spent 130 days
at the range, averaging over 700 rounds per trip
It spent 512 hours
at the range, averaging almost 180 rounds per hour
. By the way, 512 hours is more than three weeks at twenty four hours per day, seven days a week.
That rnd/hr number is a bit skewed, though, because it includes many hours on the range teaching. When you look at just my personal practice routines, the gun was regularly firing 350-550 rounds per hour
During the entire test, the pistol experienced a total of thirteen stoppages
. Those who have followed the test from the beginning will remember that the first seven were the result of an out-of-spec mainspring that was replaced before the 10,000 round mark. The last three, as reported above, were in quick succession due to the gun reaching the end of its service life. Between the time when the mainspring was replaced and the gun’s final death throes, there were only three stoppages
… that’s less than one stoppage per 27,000 rounds fired.
So what finally brought the gun to a stop? Heat. As Sam explained it, the part of the frame that was damaged is in contact with the recoil spring assembly. Every time the gun is fired, heat gets transferred through the barrel lug to the recoil assembly. Under any normal condition, that is not a problem.
But while many folks have criticized the term “torture test” to describe the pistol-training.com endurance tests, torture is exactly what these guns are subjected to. In 91,322 rounds, the gun was only cleaned fifteen times — once going over 12,000 rounds between cleanings
. It was rarely lubed more often than once every 4-5,000 rounds. Multiple days per week it was subjected to consecutive hours of high volume rapid fire practice that often made the gun too hot to touch.
I shoot a P30. I spent a great deal of time shooting other pistols and comparing features and feel...the P30 was always in the mix. I, too, was in a quandary over the price premium, but it also seemed like I was trying to talk myself out of the P30...ie. settle for something else. I am glad I bought the HK and after several hundred rounds the gun characteristics improve with each trip to the range. I love this handgun!
Last time out a PX4 shooter inquired about my P30. I let him shoot it and his response was "I wished I had checked this gun out before buying the PX4...".
You may pay a bit more, but over the life of the gun and the expense of the ammo and gear...that premium will quickly fall into the rearview mirror and matter little.
Bottom line - buy what you want and don't let a couple bucks be the determining factor. You will not regret the HK experience.
my hk uspc .40 has been the best handgun i have ever owned. i shoot it better then i did my les baer trs
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