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  1. #1
    BAC
    BAC is offline Junior Member
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    10mm - Good times or no?

    For the most part, when shooting handguns I'm shooting four guns: dad's Glock 17, good ol' Ruger Mark II, <insert random rental>, and <insert random rental>. Lets me try some variety, you know?

    The last "new guns" I've tried for rental were the Glock 36 and Kahr K40; been shooting them fairly consistently since rentals at a local range are pretty cheap and I wanted to get a good feel for 'em. First time I've ever shot anything above 9mm.

    The .40 S&W, not crazy about; the K40 was just too jumpy for my taste, and Kahr themselves said that's a common characteristic of the .40 S&W. The .45 ACP, loved, and was surprised at how well the gun handled even though it was a subcompact. More comfortable to shoot than the .40.

    Now I wanna try a 10mm.

    Diameter-wise, I know it's a .40, length-wise, I know it's a few CM longer. Compared to the .45, how is the 10mm? Most articles I've read are fairly biased about the round (love or hate, it seems), but everyone agrees that it shoots remarkably well in Glocks.

    So what do you folks think? Am I good to go if I can easily handle the .45 in a small gun, or should I expect a wee bit of monstrous boom and muzzle flip?


    -B

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  3. #2
    Mike Barham's Avatar
    Mike Barham is offline Senior Member
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    To me, 10mm in a full-size pistol feels about the same as .45ACP is a smaller gun. It's a little sharper due to the higher pressures, but not a big deal for an experienced shooter. The Glocks in 10mm are pretty big beasts, though, with very large grips.

    I personally see little use for the 10mm, except maybe as a combo outdoorsman/defense gun. (The ghost of Jeff Cooper will probably now strike me dead.)
    Employed by Galco Gunleather - www.galcogunleather.com / Veteran OEF VIII

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  4. #3
    Revolver's Avatar
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    10mm isn't the most common automatic cartridge on the market but components are easy to find(uses same bullet as .40 short&weak). If I were to get a 10mm pistol, it would be a Tanfoglio/EAA Witness. There should be no reason that you can't "handle" the recoil and report.
    Last edited by Revolver; 05-28-2007 at 12:19 AM.

  5. #4
    Revolver's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mike Barham at Galco View Post
    I personally see little use for the 10mm
    Downsize it by 1 mm and it would have to be the most common phrase I've heard when people talk pistols.

  6. #5
    Dave James is offline Junior Member
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    10mm, is a great round if you just have, to have a dual purpose handgun.like Mike posted,, it will do for 4 legged up to good sized hogs in the right hands , and I do know a gentleman that uses his on black bears.

    In the S&W series there where pigs to carry, I was issued and carried a 1085 for awhile, but there is a devoted following , the glock is just to big for most hands,in either the full size or compact, but there again they lend them selfs to grip mods rather well

    My favorite 10mm to shoot now a days belongs to a brother-in-law, its the "N" frame S&W 610 with the 3" barrel, lots of flash and bang

    recoil is a very subjective thing, but for me in the steel guns its no worse than 45acp +p stuff, but in the glocks if not using the 6" barrel it seems a little snapper, especially if the ammo is hunting rounds

    IF its some thing you can rent ,, TRY IT!!

  7. #6
    Thor's Avatar
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    I think that the 10MM has more recoil than the .45ACP. Of course, I haven't been shooting the watered down loads that seem to be common out there. I also think the .40 S&W has a little more recoil than the .45ACP. I own all three calibers of handguns.

  8. #7
    10mm Sonny's Avatar
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    If H&K made a USP in 10mm, I would buy it.
    If S&W made a M&P in 10mm, I would buy it.
    If Walther made a P99 in 10mm, I would buy it.
    If SA made a XD in 10mm, I would buy it.

  9. #8
    Dreadnought's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Revolver View Post
    10mm isn't the most common automatic cartridge on the market but components are easy to find(uses same bullet as .40 short&weak). If I were to get a 10mm pistol, it would be a Tanfoglio/EAA Witness. There should be no reason that you can't "handle" the recoil and report.
    The Tanfoglio would be my choice. I've been looking at 10 mm for a little while now. I'm tentatively looking to see if I can find a s&W 1076 in decent shape locally, and I'm in no rush.

  10. #9
    scorpiusdeus's Avatar
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    These threads are always good for a laugh. If you want a 10MM get a 10MM. First, find a place that rents one and shoot it and than go back to my advice.

    All the (XXX) is the best caliber or (XXX) is a weak hunk ho elephant dung is just a bunch of... Well, Elephant dung.

    If you like the way a weapon/caliber feels in your hand, you enjoy using it, and most importantly you use it with efficiency and skill, why wouldn't it be the best weapon/caliber EVER... for YOU?

    MY preferred Caliber is .40 S&W. I shoot it well, I shoot it often so it is the best for ME.

  11. #10
    Thor's Avatar
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    If it weren't for the big game hunting, I wouldn't own a 10MM to be quite honest. The main reason is that ammo is more expensive than any of the normal calibers. It's also getting a little bit more difficult to find at the local stores. It makes me think twice when I go an blow a box of 10MM at the range as compared to 40 S&W or 45ACP. The MN State Troopers tried the 10MM and felt that it might have overpenetration problems. They carry the 40 S&W. I carry that or a 45ACP for personal protection.

  12. #11
    Anxiety.'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thor View Post
    If it weren't for the big game hunting, I wouldn't own a 10MM to be quite honest. The main reason is that ammo is more expensive than any of the normal calibers. It's also getting a little bit more difficult to find at the local stores. It makes me think twice when I go an blow a box of 10MM at the range as compared to 40 S&W or 45ACP. The MN State Troopers tried the 10MM and felt that it might have overpenetration problems. They carry the 40 S&W. I carry that or a 45ACP for personal protection.

    So you use it to hunt? If you do what do you hunt with it? I see you are from MN, I hunt in northwest MN. It'd be whitetail for me. Before everybody freaks out, I wouldn't be using it as my main shooting piece. Mostly just a "brush gun", since it gets quite thick where we hunt. It would also double as a self-defense gun since it would be more than adiquate for that too. I don't have the resources to buy two, so I'm trying to kill two birds with one stone.

  13. #12
    Bob Wright's Avatar
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    Well, to wade in where I don't belong, as I seem to have a habit of doing: The 10mm is a fine cartridge, I've heard it compared favorably to the .41 Magnum revolver cartridge. The primary advantage of the 10mm is high velocity which gives it flatter trajectory, thus better suited to the outdoors. Having said that, it is better suited to Colt Government sized guns with adjustable sights, or even the long slide models.

    For guns such as the Glock, which are not designed as the outdsoorsman's gun, either the .40 S&W or the .45 ACP are better suited. The .45 ACP remains king, in my opinion, for defense type shooting. Its power and moderate recoil allow quicker recovery for follow-up shots, while the 230gr slug usually doesn't necessitate follow shots. The .45 ACP requires a big gun and when gun size is an issue, then smaller guns of 9mm or .380 are the choice.

    Bob Wright

  14. #13
    Mike Barham's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bob Wright View Post
    The 10mm is a fine cartridge, I've heard it compared favorably to the .41 Magnum revolver cartridge. The primary advantage of the 10mm is high velocity which gives it flatter trajectory, thus better suited to the outdoors. Having said that, it is better suited to Colt Government sized guns with adjustable sights, or even the long slide models.

    For guns such as the Glock, which are not designed as the outdsoorsman's gun, either the .40 S&W or the .45 ACP are better suited. The .45 ACP remains king, in my opinion, for defense type shooting. Its power and moderate recoil allow quicker recovery for follow-up shots, while the 230gr slug usually doesn't necessitate follow shots. The .45 ACP requires a big gun and when gun size is an issue, then smaller guns of 9mm or .380 are the choice.
    Not sure I'd compare 10mm favorably to a .41 Mag. Here are some ballistics I pulled off a 10mm fanboy site:

    Winchester 175 Gr. Silvertip 10 MM, 6" auto gave 1300fps/660fpe.

    Triton Hi-Vel 135 Gr. 10 MM, 4.6" auto gave 1350fps/550fpe.

    These figures are more in line with a hot .357 Magnum load, though granting the 10mm has more frontal area, and possibly these numbers could be improved with judicious handloading. The original Norma loads were hotter, but they quickly tore apart the Bren X, Colt's Delta Elite, and supposedly the FBI's S&W 1076s. Buffalo Bore makes a 10mm load that starts a 180 gr at 1350fps for 728fpe, but that's still over 100fpe shy of even a middlin' .41 Mag. I would be very surprised if any pistol but a Glock could take that kind of pounding for long.

    In contrast, here are some .41 Mag ballistics culled from various sources:

    A Winchester factory .41 Magnum starts a 240 gr at 1250fps for 833fpe.

    A Buffalo Bore heavy load is capable of starting a 170 gr bullet at 1650fps for 1030fpe.

    A 175 gr Silvertip hits 1250 for 670fpe - and is deemed a light .41 Magnum load.

    I do agree with you about the Glock not being a great outdoorsman's gun. I'd much rather have an N-frame revolver with adjustable sights, or if forced into an auto, a 1911, also with adjustables.

    We'll have to agree to disagree about .45 ACP, unless you have to carry ball ammo. I carried one for years, but I don't think it's better than .40, which is available in smaller guns that hold more BBs. Neither kicks hard enough to cause control problems in experienced hands.
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  15. #14
    Bob Wright's Avatar
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    Be aware that most .41 Magnum loads were from tested from pressure barrels, some vented, some not. Real world velocities fall somewhat short of published. True, the .41 Magnum outshines the 10mm, but the balliwick of the .41 and 100 is in varmint shooting, where velocity is of more concern than energy.

    And, as I said, compares favorably, not equals.

    Bob Wright

  16. #15
    nycpa is offline Junior Member
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    I have to say that shooting hot round like 10mm 135gr, 1600fps, 767ft/lbs from Double Tap Ammunition using Smith & Wesson 1076 can look very appealing. See the movie on this page:
    http://www.handgunns.com/shooting-range/sw1076.html

  17. #16
    kcdano's Avatar
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    Well, i got a EAA witness carry P for x-mas. I will try to get to the range this week and compare it to my .40 .45 and see what i think. Everone is correct in saying that ammo is a pain to find. i don't think it will ever totally go away but will be harder to find. i shall see since I just got this gun.

  18. #17
    Spartan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mike Barham View Post
    To me, 10mm in a full-size pistol feels about the same as .45ACP is a smaller gun. It's a little sharper due to the higher pressures, but not a big deal for an experienced shooter. The Glocks in 10mm are pretty big beasts, though, with very large grips.

    I personally see little use for the 10mm, except maybe as a combo outdoorsman/defense gun. (The ghost of Jeff Cooper will probably now strike me dead.)
    Not if The Nug'* gets you first.


    *That's short for Nugent if it didn't come across well typed out.

  19. #18
    Mike Barham's Avatar
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    I think you write it as "The Nuge."
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  20. #19
    Randall Donahoo's Avatar
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    Original question...

    To answer the original question, you are definitely "good to go," BAC. I am 5'9" with matching hands but undersized thumbs, I think. The recoil of my Glock 20 in 10mm with standard, non-ported barrel is no big deal. About like 357 mag in my Security Six. The grip could be no larger, though, and still allow me to confidently hold the pistol. Not a perfect fit, but I love the cartridge. Yeah, expensive and sources are limited, but I just won't burn up a lot of ammo.

    I guess I should add that I recently purchased some CorBon hunting ammo, and when I shoot it, I may find it has a bit more whack the the stock ammo I have previously shot. Also, with winter in full swing and no nearby indoor ranges, I've only shot about 20 rounds through this new Glock.

  21. #20
    kcdano's Avatar
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    I have found that 10mm ammo can be found online without any problems.

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