U would have to pay the $200 ATF fee for a short barrelled rifle, and get permission and fill out all the forms to put a butt stock on it.

Also, those Ar pistols are kewl. but I think U should look at the Keltec 556 pistol. Its just as kewl, and from what I understand, doesn't get as dirty internally as an AR.

i actually would want to do both conversions at the same time, basically using the pistol's lower reciever with a rifle's upper and buttstock. i just don't know if all the parts are compatable. i will look into the keltec too.

the specific model i was looking at is the carbon 15 model 21s

Just remember that you cannot put a but stock on it or a forward grip or it will be illegal (must register through ATF)

so if i convert my AR pistol to a rifle by adding a 16" upper reciever and a standard buttstock, i need a special permit? or do i only need the atf permit to add just the buttstock to the handgun? are the upper receivers interchangable between the ar pistols and rifles?

Originally Posted by big dutchman

so if i convert my AR pistol to a rifle by adding a 16" upper reciever and a standard buttstock, i need a special permit? or do i only need the atf permit to add just the buttstock to the handgun? are the upper receivers interchangable between the ar pistols and rifles?

Be best to ask a lawyer but I believe if you put the 16" barrel on first and then the stock it is not then nor was it ever a short barreled rifle.

Here is a couple of links to pages on a site that should have the info you want.


http://www.arizonashooting.com/forum...forum.php?f=39

http://www.arizonashooting.com/forum...78f7c9f2f28cba

Check into a K-T PLR-16. Operationally, they are a cross between an HK and an AR, using the best features of both. I have one (it's my avatar here) and they are a blast - a pun WAS intended - to shoot. They cost about $500 more or less and FWIW, pistols can have a stock under the barrel. TC Contenders have had them for decades. They have a good list of options available at the K-T web site.

i think that the links provided by 2400 answered my questions pretty well - thanks everyone. i have spent some time looking into the PLR-16 today, and i do like what i see there as well. now i have to decide if it's worth the extra $300 bucks to buy the bushmaster pistol that i can convert to a rifle, or get the keltec with some accessories and extra ammo. hmmm

Originally Posted by big dutchman

i think that the links provided by 2400 answered my questions pretty well - thanks everyone. i have spent some time looking into the PLR-16 today, and i do like what i see there as well. now i have to decide if it's worth the extra $300 bucks to buy the bushmaster pistol that i can convert to a rifle, or get the keltec with some accessories and extra ammo. hmmm

Buy ya a PS90, dude. 50 round mag....

they do look interesting to me. after reading many of your posts on them, i even tried to find a range that had one i could rent. no luck so far. the ammo cost would probably cause my wife to bury me in the back yard, i'm running close to it already with the 357sig and 44mag. the 233 ammo is pretty cheap in my area and i already have a few cases for my mini14.

U'll probably never find one to rent.

I posted several messages on various sites, trying to find someone in my area who would let me shoot theirs. I almost gave up after 2 months of looking, and then 2 separate people let me shoot theirs on the same weekend.

When I got back home from shooting the 1st one, I immediately ordered all the accessory rails and everything else I wanted for one. I was sold

I didn't wanna spend that much cash w/o trying one. But, everytime I pick it up, I smile

Better get one soon, if this new assault weapon ban goes anywhere... I went ahead and ordered 1 more mag just in case...

the possibility of the ban is scary. i have postponed my regular handgun purchases so that i can buy the potentially banned long guns that i wanted to buy in the future. i am really liking the reviews and features of the keltek plr-16, but i almost want to buy the bushmaster pistol in case the ban does go though, at least then i would have the lower to make a ar rifle too. maybe i should just go ahead and buy them both..........the garage is heated enough to sleep comfortably once my wife kicks me out.

Originally Posted by big dutchman

the garage is heated enough to sleep comfortably once my wife kicks me out.

I found those little electric space heaters work well in a garage too if it is insulated at all,just lay a blanket across the bottom of the big door to reduce the drafts

Originally Posted by big dutchman

so if i convert my AR pistol to a rifle by adding a 16" upper reciever and a standard buttstock, i need a special permit? or do i only need the atf permit to add just the buttstock to the handgun? are the upper receivers interchangable between the ar pistols and rifles?

If you add a forward grip to an AR pistol, you have an Any Other Weapon (AOW). If you add just a buttstock, you have a shoulder-fired Short-Barreled Rifle (SBR). If you add a barrel at least 16 inches in length and a buttstock, you now technically have a legal rifle but it's still registered as being "made" as a pistol, which also is a no-no.

The best thing to do if you want to modify the pistol and stay legal would be to register the pistol as an AOW ($5 tax) and/or an SBR ($200 tax) (depending on whether or not you wanted a stock) on a Form 1. You could then change it around however you wanted, as often as you wanted. It would be legal with a stock on it (registered SBR) and the stock off (registered AOW). If you got tired of it, you notify the BATFE, get rid of the extra parts, and return it to the original pistol configuration.

Or, just get an AR pistol and an AR rifle.

Here's a link that may provide some more info: http://www.titleii.com/BardwellOLD/nfa_faq.txt

I knew I'd seen AR pistol info somewhere; I should have looked here first. Here's a link to more info than you probably want about AR pistols: http://www.ar15.com/forums/forum.html?b=3&f=122