Bullet pushed back into the casing? umm help?

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    1. #1
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      Bullet pushed back into the casing? umm help?

      I noticed that on my 40 cal Federal Hydrashock round that the gray/silver inside piece holding the post is very loose. It actually wiggles a bit inside the brass colored jacket. It seems that the constant loading, and unloading of my Springfield XD-40 Subcompact (everyday when I leave for work, and unloading when I come home) has somehow loosened it up...does that make sense? And when I put it bottom down on a table right next to a round from deeper in the mag, and drop a ruler on top if it, the ruler is actually slanted down....showing me that the constant loading and unloading has somehow pushed the bullet into the casing a bit. Is this a big deal, is it dangerous? Should I discard this round? Or will it still fire ok? Please help as I have never seen, nor heard of this happening before.

    2. #2
      TOF
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      Quote Originally Posted by ClayBreaker08 View Post
      I noticed that on my 40 cal Federal Hydrashock round that the gray/silver inside piece holding the post is very loose. It actually wiggles a bit inside the brass colored jacket. It seems that the constant loading, and unloading of my Springfield XD-40 Subcompact (everyday when I leave for work, and unloading when I come home) has somehow loosened it up...does that make sense? And when I put it bottom down on a table right next to a round from deeper in the mag, and drop a ruler on top if it, the ruler is actually slanted down....showing me that the constant loading and unloading has somehow pushed the bullet into the casing a bit. Is this a big deal, is it dangerous? Should I discard this round? Or will it still fire ok? Please help as I have never seen, nor heard of this happening before.
      Yes it is dangerous and also common. Do not shoot that round.

      Why do you unload every evening? You need a round chambered if it is to be used for home security purposes.

      I simply unholster, Place mine in its ready position for the night then reholster the next morning. Should some slimeball decide to visit in the dark it is always ready.

      You haven't setup your location map so we can't tell if you are in DC or some other location where you have to dissassemble the gun every night.

    3. #3
      Senior Member JeffWard's Avatar
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      Discard the round. Do NOT fire it.

      The 40 S&W is a very high pressure round to begin with. Couple that with a smaller space to light that charge in, and you've got potential trouble.

      The repeated impact of the nose of the bullet with the feed ramp day after day after day, can drive the bullet back into the case. Less space for the powder charge, means a VERY fast ramp up in pressure in the chamber, which even the "fully supported chamber" (mocking a buddy here) of the XD might not deal with well... causing a Glock-esque Kaboom... (Waiting for Mike to slap me all the way from AZ)...

      If you MUST unload at home, reload by locking back the slide, dropping the bullet into the chamber, give it a barrel-down shake to fully seat the case, release the slide making sure it goes fully into battery, and then slam in a full mag.

      A good visual check of your self defense ammo every few months is a good idea anyway, checking for bulges, or damage to the nose of the hollowpoints that may cause feed issues... I load and unload the same 10-shot mag in my XD9SC, sometimes 2 times per week, when I go to the range. I practice with the same mag I carry. TWICE now, I've damaged the lead lip of a hollowpoint, repeatedly loading and unloading them into the mag. I'm not sure the slight damage would cause a feed issue. I doubt it... But those damaged bullets went into the practice session, and were replaced for defensive carry.

      Call me nitpicky-obsessive... but it's my life that bullet might endanger, if it decides not to feed...

      JeffWard

    4. #4
      Senior Member Ram Rod's Avatar
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      It's called bullet set-back. It will blow up your XD like a Glock if you fire it! That would be called a 'KB' or kaboom.

    5. #5
      Member kev74's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by Ram Rod View Post
      It will blow up your XD like a Glock...


      That's a great visual!

    6. #6
      Senior Member Bob Wright's Avatar
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      Bullet set-back is easily cured by pulling the bullet with either an inertia bullet puller or a collet type. With a collet type, simply pull the bullet almost all the way out, then place it in the seating die and re-seat to correct length.

      An inertia puller can be used the same way, but usually will pull the bullet all the way out. When tyhis happens, its best to discard the powder charge and recharge with a fresh loading.

      Bob Wright

    7. #7
      Senior Member Ram Rod's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by kev74 View Post


      That's a great visual!
      Well, here's the visual. By the way...I'm a Glock fan with a good sense of humor. Enjoy!

    8. #8
      Senior Member tekhead1219's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by Ram Rod View Post
      Well, here's the visual. By the way...I'm a Glock fan with a good sense of humor. Enjoy!
      Now THAT's a great visual....

    9. #9
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      That's good comedy..

      ..Yeah..if you don't reload then get rid of the round. It wont do you any good to keep it unless you want something else messing up your desk at home.

    10. #10
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      I believe some police agencies tell their officers that after chambering a round, cycle it to the bottom of the magazine and chamber a new round. Don't chamber a round more than 2-3x before tossing it out.

    11. #11
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      Quote Originally Posted by JeffWard View Post

      If you MUST unload at home, reload by locking back the slide, dropping the bullet into the chamber, give it a barrel-down shake to fully seat the case, release the slide making sure it goes fully into battery, and then slam in a full mag.


      I would NOT do this unless you want to cause FAST wear on your extractor.

    12. #12
      Senior Member Ram Rod's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by Brodeurman69 View Post
      I would NOT do this unless you want to cause FAST wear on your extractor.
      That's good advice right there. Really. I'll second that notion any time. BTW......the 40S&W cartridge compared to others...........a 1/10" bullet set-back into the case on the 40S&W will double the pressure of the load. 35,000psi to 70,000psi just like that. Although the Glock's design of the not fully supported chamber in the 40 and 45 caliber pistols doesn't help matters, we can limit the possibilities of any malfunctions with a little bit of knowledge, and utilizing some common sense. Be safe, be happy, practice often.
      FYI---most recent Glock KB came from a member of another forum yesterday. It was a 23c model (40 S&W), and the guy was shooting Wolf ammo. Wolf ammo is generally steel case and lacquer coated. I see a lot of this stuff laying around at the range--unfired/live rounds that have obviously been chambered and extracted. Mainly I find the .223 Rem. I know ammo cost is getting higher every week, and we're all trying to cut corners in order to buy gasoline or something that might be banned in the near future due to political change...but seriously---we need to put our priorities in order. If you've got an AK-47 then by all means buy the bulk/surplus stuff steel case or whatever. AK's were built for that. Be safe.
      Last edited by Ram Rod; 09-25-2008 at 04:32 AM.

    13. #13
      Senior Member zhurdan's Avatar
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      I guess I can't understand why people are loading and unloading their guns so much. Basically the only time I unload my guns is when I go to the range and that's because I'm shoot it. There's the rare occasion that I unload some carry rounds, but that's just one round coming out of the tube, the mag stays loaded, that's why I have other mags for practice rounds. If something doesn't need to be done (unloading) don't do it, it's just one more point for an ND to happen.

      I also do not recommend dropping the slide on a round in the chamber. The system is designed to strip a round from the magazine, use the system how it is intended.

      Bullet setback is just one more reason I shoot the .357 Sig and .45, Bottleneck cartridges rarely have any bullet set back, or feeding problems. .45's are like throwing a hot dog down a hallway, bigger diameter gives you more angle to work with.

      Zhur

    14. #14
      Member Willy D's Avatar
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      The way I do it is I have no magazine in the gun, lock the slide back and put one in the chamber, pull back slide release lock and ease the slide forward...then I put the magazine in the gun...It stays loaded like that untill I go to the range to shoot it...at that point, I pull the mag out and then cycle the slide to get the one out of the chamber...Then I pick up another mag and load it with practice ammo, slide mag in the gun the slide forward and shoot....at the end of my range time, I reload the hollowpoints the same as before...never slamming the round into the chamber when initally getting it locked and loaded...

      Is this incorrect??

      Willy

    15. #15
      Senior Member zhurdan's Avatar
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      Willy,
      I'd say yes, it is incorrect. Simply because again, that isn't how the system is designed to work. When you do it the way you mentioned, the extractor is forced to go straight over the lip of the round, whereas if it is loaded from a magazine, the round slides underneath the extractor as it is loaded into the barrel. Realistically the average shooter isn't going to wear out their extractor by slamming it home, but why take the chance. Parts do need replacing to be sure, but I just wouldn't want it to break when I need it.

      There is one other thing to consider when talking about extractors. There are spring steel extractors, that are one long piece of steel, like most 1911's, then there are block style extractors which are composed of 3 different parts. The extractor itself, a push rod and a spring (the pin would make 4 parts I guess). Those types, common on Glocks, Kahrs and others are probably far less affected by the process you describe as you are working against a coil spring, not spring steel. Again, either way, it's not designed that way, so I'd recommend against it.


      Zhur

    16. #16
      Member Willy D's Avatar
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      OK...I was just a bit confused...The way I did do it before (XD45 and XD9) was to lock slide back, load defensive rounds into the mag and then pull back on the slide, release lock and ease the slide forward making sure that the round indicator showed a round in the chamber and the striker was back and ready to go...slide all the way forward...

      then a few months back I read on this forum somewhere where someone talked about setback and how .45 was the worst for it...the poster described doing it with directly loading the chamber as I stated in my last post....Just curious..if I ease the slide forward and it pulls a round out of the mag and it goes in the chamber without a harsh slam, will that avoid set back?

      Willy

    17. #17
      TOF
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      I have been following the procedure of removing the Magazine inserting one with Target Ammo in it and shooting the protection round as the first shot of practice. Prior to leaving the range I reload with Protection Ammo and will remove the chambered round for 1 cleaning cycle only.

      I have tested my Protection Ammo (Winchester Ranger) by cycling a few rounds through by hand several times. I have not encountered setback so feel one removal and reinsertion is acceptable.

      This procedure burns a box of higher cost ammo per year. I believe it is worth it.

      Just keep in mind, all ammo is not created equal so you need to test function in several ways.

      Stay safe by keeping it loaded.

    18. #18
      Senior Member zhurdan's Avatar
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      Great idea TOF... sometimes the simplest solutions are the best! I think I'll take up that practice.

      Zhur

    19. #19
      Member Willy D's Avatar
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      That sounds good to me...a little more good ammo bought instead of a "kaboom"....

      thanks

      Willy

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