Page 3 of 4 FirstFirst 1234 LastLast
Results 41 to 60 of 77
  1. #41
    Mike Barham's Avatar
    Mike Barham is offline Senior Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    Arizona, baby!
    Posts
    5,081
    Shotguns are perfectly defensible in court. All else is blather designed to sell gun magazines.
    Employed by Galco Gunleather - www.galcogunleather.com / Veteran OEF VIII

    Donate to the Christian and Stephanie Nielson Recovery fund: http://www.nierecovery.com/.

    All opinions, particularly those involving politics and Glocks, are mine and not Galco's.

  2. #42
    CMSpecs is offline Junior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Posts
    13
    Quote Originally Posted by Mike Barham View Post
    Uhhh, yeah, I'm well aware that my M9 is loaded with ball ammo. But thanks for the heads-up on that.

    But it's not what I'd choose if I had a choice. You understand the difference, right?



    You are completely misinformed. NYPD, for example, got away from 9mm ball because they had so many cases of perforation on human targets. Those exiting FMJ bullets, which according to you "ain't gonna overpenetrate" hit a total of 5 uninvolved bystanders in that crowded city, as well as 17 police officers. 14 suspects were also killed by bullets that perforated other suspects. That's a total of 36 people. These were all FMJ 9mm bullets that had already passed through other people before they hit a second person.

    (These stats came from an NYPD report quoted verbatim in The New York Times.)

    In tests in ballistic gelatin, 9mm ball typically digs to 24+", with some examples going to 28". "Acceptable" penetration per the FBI protocols ends at 16", and most sources prefer 11-14" of depth. Most good modern JHPs fall somewhere in the 11-16" range.

    If you prefer ball ammo in 9mm, that's okay with me. It's your life. I just hope I am not downrange if you have to fire in defense, like all those unlucky people in New York. I also hope, for their sake, none of your family members are anywhere behind the bad guy.
    I never said I preferred it. I've just witnessed a lot of fmj slugs being picked outta corpses & folks waiting to get stitched up.
    Ok you use the NYPD as an example here man? Do you know how many lawsuits that Dept has to date since 1987? Many of which false shootings of toddlers, homeless people,black people, you name it. not to mention the guy they shot 43 times a few years back. And the groom they recently slaughtered. what was it 50 rounds fired? I'll ay it again 50 ROUNDS fired Mikey. 21 hit the car, where did the other 29 go? Over the hudson river? Or into that guys face? That Dept is plauged with too many inexpirienced cops in too many areas to argue. And shooting skills is one of em. But thats not the point here, you used them but they are not what the topic is about man.
    You see this puts me back in that post you just had goin and locked up about the scenario in the store & takin a shot at 35yds away and yadda yadda. Even if you got jhps,glaser rounds or whatever anti-penetratin magic in your bullet. Takin a shot with folks(let alone your friggen family) BEHIND the BG is just too much of a risk. And I'm tellin you, if you gotta draw your gun the situation is stressful anyway. The worse feeling you ever wanna deal with. Too much of a chance of a miss with or without JHPs. I mean think about that man. If you gotta shoot your gun at a living body, and then you mentioned family members BEHIND him/her? Heck no man.

    I would never shoot with my family BEHIND my target. Thats just stupid anyway you look it at there Mikey. Supposed you miss and hit one of your family members, then what huh? Now you got a dead family member and a BG still left.

  3. #43
    CMSpecs is offline Junior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Posts
    13
    I'm not pickin on you Mike. I'm just talkin to you man. If it comes off like I'm bein rude, don't take offense man.

  4. #44
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    Lexington
    Posts
    1,083
    Even if you hit a family member, they probably have a better chance at living getting hit with a JHP...less penetration equals no exit wound for additional bleeding while you wait for the police and ambulance to show up, and might not penetrate deep enough to hit vitals, although that would be very iffy. A FMJ will most definitely penetrate far enough to hit vitals, and probably go right through them, hitting another family member standing behind them. A FMJ will also perforate the BG and hit a family member standing behind them, or perforate the BG, go through the wall, and hit a family member on the other side.

    JHPs rarely go through a human...if they do, it's usually because the bullet didn't hit COM, and went through a leg or arm. Even if it does perforate a BG and hit someone on the other side, it's already expanded and lost most of its energy, whereas a FMJ will have plenty of energy behind it to take it deep into another human.

    Even if the NYPD has bad shooters, a FMJ is still more dangerous to innocents standing around. If they miss with a JHP and hit someone they don't mean to shoot, odds are it will stop in that person. A FMJ will keep going, and possibly take out more innocents.

    edit: When would a BG stand in front of family members he's holding hostage? That would be stupid on his part as he's turned his back to people that could easily knock him out or kill him with a blow to the back of the head from a hand or any blunt object that happens to be nearby. Not only that, they would put themselves in broad view. BGs will typically place a family member in front of him so to get to him, you gotta go through your family member.

    Quote Originally Posted by Mike Barham View Post
    Shotguns are perfectly defensible in court. All else is blather designed to sell gun magazines.
    Well it makes sense in a lot of ways. They're cheaper than handguns and rifles, easier to become proficient with, and they spread the shot. It's not the spread that Hollywood portrays it to be, but even a 4-6" spread in HD distances gets a higher probability to score a hit. And even though buckshot has the potential to porforate a human, it doesn't have as much chance as a high powered hunting rifle with FMJ ammo.

  5. #45
    Dredd is offline Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Posts
    267
    Quote Originally Posted by fivehourfrenzy View Post
    Even if you hit a family member, they probably have a better chance at living getting hit with a JHP...less penetration equals no exit wound for additional bleeding while you wait for the police and ambulance to show up, and might not penetrate deep enough to hit vitals, although that would be very iffy. A FMJ will most definitely penetrate far enough to hit vitals, and probably go right through them, hitting another family member standing behind them. A FMJ will also perforate the BG and hit a family member standing behind them, or perforate the BG, go through the wall, and hit a family member on the other side.

    JHPs rarely go through a human...if they do, it's usually because the bullet didn't hit COM, and went through a leg or arm. Even if it does perforate a BG and hit someone on the other side, it's already expanded and lost most of its energy, whereas a FMJ will have plenty of energy behind it to take it deep into another human.

    Even if the NYPD has bad shooters, a FMJ is still more dangerous to innocents standing around. If they miss with a JHP and hit someone they don't mean to shoot, odds are it will stop in that person. A FMJ will keep going, and possibly take out more innocents.

    edit: When would a BG stand in front of family members he's holding hostage? That would be stupid on his part as he's turned his back to people that could easily knock him out or kill him with a blow to the back of the head from a hand or any blunt object that happens to be nearby. Not only that, they would put themselves in broad view. BGs will typically place a family member in front of him so to get to him, you gotta go through your family member.



    Well it makes sense in a lot of ways. They're cheaper than handguns and rifles, easier to become proficient with, and they spread the shot. It's not the spread that Hollywood portrays it to be, but even a 4-6" spread in HD distances gets a higher probability to score a hit. And even though buckshot has the potential to porforate a human, it doesn't have as much chance as a high powered hunting rifle with FMJ ammo.
    Actually JHP rounds have MORE chance to kill someone than ball. a JHP 9mm round expsnds upwards of .65 caliber which creates a larger wound channel than just a 9mm ball zipping through. This creates more shock as well. Typically JHP loads are hotter than FMJ in order to have more energy on target.

  6. #46
    Dredd is offline Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Posts
    267
    Quote Originally Posted by Mike Barham View Post
    Perhaps you'd care to cite some of those "many" cases for us?

    Even Mas Ayoob, who is the misunderstood source of most of these urban legends, recommends shotguns for home defense.
    not just shotguns, but in general. Using a .357 Magnum got some lady out in Arizona in a heap of crap when she shot someone who broke down her door at night.

    Most of the time it's not criminal charges, but the family of the moron who broke into your house who claim "they were laying in wait to kill him and he was such a nice boy."

    Yeah sure, that's why the gangs around call him by some street name and he was arrested on drug charges a month ago.

    I just really hope I never actually have to shoot at someone.

  7. #47
    Dredd is offline Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Posts
    267
    Quote Originally Posted by fivehourfrenzy View Post
    Those uninformed juries probably also follow the misconception that buckshot has less potential to perforate walls.

    All I would tell them is I heard something downstairs, and instead of being a jackass and setting out to look for him, I did the smart thing and waited until he came to me, at which point he is the one initiating a confrontation. He's a home invader, and in my home. We have the Castle Doctrine, so any use of deadly physical force I choose to use to protect myself is justifiable.

    And like I said, nobody feels a load of 00 buck hit them in the top of the head. I will get a positive ID on a target before I fire, but if the person sneaking up the steps is indeed in my home uninvited, they'll get plugged.

    Now I need to go out and get a shotgun.
    Then you face civil courts for the suffering you caused that dude's family. Hopefully the Castle Doctrine protects you from that. I don't know the details of it, but there may be some crap to clean up before you can wipe your hands of responsibility for some druggy trying to steal your gold watch to pawn for crack.

  8. #48
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    Lexington
    Posts
    1,083
    I don't know the exact outlines of the Castle Doctrine in and of itself, but the Kentucky Revised Statutes regarding self-protection while in an occupied dwelling pretty much cover the fact. Basically if someone unlawfully enters your dwelling (which is a felony), they are presumed to have intent to commit further unlawful acts with or without use of violent physical force. This can be met with physical force or deadly physical force. I have it right here in my CCDW handbook but I'm not about to spend 20 minutes typing it all out. If someone breaks in, I can shoot them. It's pretty clear cut.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dredd View Post
    Actually JHP rounds have MORE chance to kill someone than ball. a JHP 9mm round expsnds upwards of .65 caliber which creates a larger wound channel than just a 9mm ball zipping through. This creates more shock as well. Typically JHP loads are hotter than FMJ in order to have more energy on target.
    I'm gonna have to disagree on this one. I addressed this issue in my "lethality of JHP versus ball ammo, etc." thread. I believe most of the time, ball ammo, although it doesn't expand and cause a larger cavity, does produce an exit wound, therefore meaning blood has two holes instead of one to bleed out. Also, it will almost always have enough penetration to hit vitals. JHPs rely on expansion to produce their maximum wound and trauma on a person...and I believe (I could be wrong) statistics show that JHPs only expand 60-70% of the time at best, meaning 30-40% of the time, they don't expand. Generally speaking when they don't expand, they do penetrate further, but not as far as ball ammo.

    I'm not sure. This argument could go both ways. I do know that JHP, if properly expanded, will deliver all of its kinetic energy into the person, assuming it doesn't pass through and exit. This goes into "stopping" an attacker. The expansion also produces a larger cavity, like you mentioned, but I think a non-expanding FMJ that exits will still cause faster bleeding than an expanded bullet of the same weight/caliber that only creates a one-holed wound channel. There are beliefs that ball ammo (because of non-expanding properties) might slightly miss a vital or CNS component that an expanding JHP would hit. However, I think there would be more accounts of JHP not penetrating deep enough to hit a vital, whereas ball ammo would pass directly through.

    Also keep in mind that lethality isn't the same as stopping power. I think someone who's bleeding more severely from an entrance and exit wound from ball ammo would be in more danger of bleeding to death unless they had immediate medical attention. I would say a lot of people that die from handgun wounds (barring those that take head shots) don't die because of destruction of a vital organ, but simply bleed to death before they can get help from paramedics. That could be completely false, but it's an estimate. One could survive from multiple shots in their torso, assuming they don't get their heart, liver, or lungs shredded and don't bleed to death. On the flip side, someone who takes a measly leg shot might bleed to death if their femoral artery is severed.

    It makes sense that JHPs would be more lethal as they have more "stopping" power than ball ammo, but there are certain instances where ball ammo would kill, and JHP would not. I'm waiting for Mike and some of the others to chime in on this one.

  9. #49
    CMSpecs is offline Junior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Posts
    13
    fivehourfrenzy,
    I didnt know which of your posts to quote man lol. I don't even know where to begin here. But, I'm not gonna go on & on about this. Not even worth the typing anymore now. I tell ya what, you go ahead and shoot your family with JHPs,FMJs,Glasers,buckshot, and live by whatever rules you feel okaying the nill THOUGHT of even shooting in their direction let alone at their bodies. I've threw in my hand on this here.

  10. #50
    Mike Barham's Avatar
    Mike Barham is offline Senior Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    Arizona, baby!
    Posts
    5,081
    Quote Originally Posted by CMSpecs View Post
    I'm not pickin on you Mike. I'm just talkin to you man. If it comes off like I'm bein rude, don't take offense man.
    No offense taken, though I prefer you address me as "Mike," not "Mikey." Treating me like a child doesn't help your argument.

    Anyway, I posted about NYPD not to argue the merits or demerits of that department, or the shooting ability of the NYPD. I was refuting your obviously erroneous statement that 9mm FMJ does not perforate human targets. Quite clearly, it does, and often.
    Employed by Galco Gunleather - www.galcogunleather.com / Veteran OEF VIII

    Donate to the Christian and Stephanie Nielson Recovery fund: http://www.nierecovery.com/.

    All opinions, particularly those involving politics and Glocks, are mine and not Galco's.

  11. #51
    Mike Barham's Avatar
    Mike Barham is offline Senior Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    Arizona, baby!
    Posts
    5,081
    Quote Originally Posted by Dredd View Post
    Using a .357 Magnum got some lady out in Arizona in a heap of crap when she shot someone who broke down her door at night.
    Okay, please cite the case. You know, a case name (State of Arizona v. Jane Doe, Estate of Joe Scumbag v. Jane Doe, etc.), or even a link to a newspaper article? I live in Arizona and work in the gun industry, and never heard about this. I find it very difficult to believe that a lone woman would get in trouble for shooting an intruder, no matter what gun she used, in a solidly pro-gun state like Arizona.

    Most of the time it's not criminal charges, but the family of the moron who broke into your house who claim "they were laying in wait to kill him and he was such a nice boy."
    Lawsuits abound in litigious America, and you're very likely to be sued no matter what weapon you use to shoot someone. But you're certainly no more likely to be sued if you use a shotgun or a .357 than if you use a 9mm or a .40.

    I'm a graduate of Mas Ayoob's LFI school. A lot of the stuff you hear bandied about regarding guns and criminal charges and lawsuits is stuff that people heard fourth-hand and claim that "Well, Mas Ayoob said..." Mainly it's exaggerated crap, and no better than any other gun store gossip or misinformed stuff you see on the Errornet. I blame Combat Handguns magazine, and its sensationalist covers, for a lot of this.
    Employed by Galco Gunleather - www.galcogunleather.com / Veteran OEF VIII

    Donate to the Christian and Stephanie Nielson Recovery fund: http://www.nierecovery.com/.

    All opinions, particularly those involving politics and Glocks, are mine and not Galco's.

  12. #52
    Mike Barham's Avatar
    Mike Barham is offline Senior Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    Arizona, baby!
    Posts
    5,081
    Quote Originally Posted by CMSpecs View Post
    fivehourfrenzy,
    I didnt know which of your posts to quote man lol. I don't even know where to begin here. But, I'm not gonna go on & on about this. Not even worth the typing anymore now. I tell ya what, you go ahead and shoot your family with JHPs,FMJs,Glasers,buckshot, and live by whatever rules you feel okaying the nill THOUGHT of even shooting in their direction let alone at their bodies. I've threw in my hand on this here.
    I don't see where fhf is advocating firing at his family or anything remotely like that. Let's stick to the technical issues here instead of personal attacks.

    A bullet that exits creates two holes instead of one. This theoretically increases the chance of pneumothorax/hemothorax, which may be more likely to cause death than the slightly greater permanent wound cavity created by an expanded JHP, depending on the location of the wound.
    Employed by Galco Gunleather - www.galcogunleather.com / Veteran OEF VIII

    Donate to the Christian and Stephanie Nielson Recovery fund: http://www.nierecovery.com/.

    All opinions, particularly those involving politics and Glocks, are mine and not Galco's.

  13. #53
    Don357's Avatar
    Don357 is offline Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Semmes AL
    Posts
    176
    Quote Originally Posted by submoa View Post
    I've read several articles by Ayoob suggesting modelling your SD weapon choices after LE is a good idea when you need to testify in a SD shooting.

    Expanding bullets and large wound channels might not be considered humane by the politically correct. So I can understand why the politicos would limit LE and military to ball ammo.

    On the other hand assholes who threaten my life and/or those of my family are not deserving of humane treatment.
    Would'nt an instant death be more humane than hours or days of suffering pain and or bleeding to death???
    I use several different loads for my 9mm's. For plinking I use Monarch (Barnaul) or Winchester, or Blazer 115gr FMJ, but for defence my wife carrys Federal Premium 124gr "Hydra-Shoks" in her Kel-Tec P-11 and I carry Winchester Personal Defence 147gr JHP in my TZ99. Both guns will eat anything you care to feed them, but the heavier bullet seems to be a bit more accurate in my TZ, not to mention penetration and knockdown power. BTW, I also carry my TZ as a back-up when I go hunting. Wild hogs don't go down easy!

  14. #54
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    Lexington
    Posts
    1,083
    Quote Originally Posted by CMSpecs View Post
    fivehourfrenzy,
    I didnt know which of your posts to quote man lol. I don't even know where to begin here. But, I'm not gonna go on & on about this. Not even worth the typing anymore now. I tell ya what, you go ahead and shoot your family with JHPs,FMJs,Glasers,buckshot, and live by whatever rules you feel okaying the nill THOUGHT of even shooting in their direction let alone at their bodies. I've threw in my hand on this here.
    Shoot my family? Dude man bro buddy you need to grow up. Just because I can justify my reasonings while you can't doesn't make room for irresponsible, immature posts like that.

  15. #55
    Dredd is offline Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Posts
    267
    Quote Originally Posted by Mike Barham View Post
    Okay, please cite the case. You know, a case name (State of Arizona v. Jane Doe, Estate of Joe Scumbag v. Jane Doe, etc.), or even a link to a newspaper article? I live in Arizona and work in the gun industry, and never heard about this. I find it very difficult to believe that a lone woman would get in trouble for shooting an intruder, no matter what gun she used, in a solidly pro-gun state like Arizona.



    Lawsuits abound in litigious America, and you're very likely to be sued no matter what weapon you use to shoot someone. But you're certainly no more likely to be sued if you use a shotgun or a .357 than if you use a 9mm or a .40.

    I'm a graduate of Mas Ayoob's LFI school. A lot of the stuff you hear bandied about regarding guns and criminal charges and lawsuits is stuff that people heard fourth-hand and claim that "Well, Mas Ayoob said..." Mainly it's exaggerated crap, and no better than any other gun store gossip or misinformed stuff you see on the Errornet. I blame Combat Handguns magazine, and its sensationalist covers, for a lot of this.
    I remember what i read, but never can remember names or specifics. The point is, it happens. Some DA gets on the case and is a hard ass. Plain and simple. It's the risk you take with you. I know there's more problems with shooting someone than there should be. Especially when it's on your property and the person is unwanted and uninvited.

    I don't claim to be some sort of expert, but I have read things that make me think seriously about the topic.

    I guess my whole point is you can't just go and shoot someone who you suspect an intruder and everyone says "ok sir, no problem". That's all I really mean to say. There is more that goes along with it after the incident.

  16. #56
    Mike Barham's Avatar
    Mike Barham is offline Senior Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    Arizona, baby!
    Posts
    5,081
    Quote Originally Posted by Dredd View Post
    The point is, it happens.
    And my point is, it doesn't happen with anywhere near the frequency people on the internet claim it does. How can you expect us to believe "it happens" if no one can produce any actual evidence that it happens? You can tell us to believe in UFOs, too, but unless you can produce some evidence, you're not going to get very far.

    The only person who can ever seem to actually cite real-life instances of this is Mas Ayoob, and most commonly even in the cases he cites, the particular gun used only has a peripheral involvement to the charges being brought, or the lawsuit being filed.

    I'm not saying to use a Browning 1919 for HD, but something like a shotgun or .357 revolver is perfectly fine and totally defensible.

    There is more that goes along with it after the incident.
    I agree that we have to think about Problem Two in advance, but we shouldn't unnecessarily handicap ourselves when it solving to Problem One, by ignoring easily-defensible weapons because of some unfounded rumors circulating on the internet and in gun shops. If we don't survive the lethal encounter, then what happens in court is a rather moot point.
    Employed by Galco Gunleather - www.galcogunleather.com / Veteran OEF VIII

    Donate to the Christian and Stephanie Nielson Recovery fund: http://www.nierecovery.com/.

    All opinions, particularly those involving politics and Glocks, are mine and not Galco's.

  17. #57
    Dredd is offline Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Posts
    267
    Quote Originally Posted by Mike Barham View Post
    And my point is, it doesn't happen with anywhere near the frequency people on the internet claim it does. How can you expect us to believe "it happens" if no one can produce any actual evidence that it happens? You can tell us to believe in UFOs, too, but unless you can produce some evidence, you're not going to get very far.

    The only person who can ever seem to actually cite real-life instances of this is Mas Ayoob, and most commonly even in the cases he cites, the particular gun used only has a peripheral involvement to the charges being brought, or the lawsuit being filed.

    I'm not saying to use a Browning 1919 for HD, but something like a shotgun or .357 revolver is perfectly fine and totally defensible.



    I agree that we have to think about Problem Two in advance, but we shouldn't unnecessarily handicap ourselves when it solving to Problem One, by ignoring easily-defensible weapons because of some unfounded rumors circulating on the internet and in gun shops. If we don't survive the lethal encounter, then what happens in court is a rather moot point.
    I'm confident that I can pop 2-3shots in COM with my pistol calibers much more than I am to hit on target with my 12 guage. Simply because I rarely shoot the shotgun and have alot of practice time in on the pistol. That's important too, confidence in your ability.

  18. #58
    DevilsJohnson is offline Senior Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    Kentucky
    Posts
    3,373
    For a 9mm It will depend on what pistol I've got out of the safe. My Sig 226 seems to like the 147 jhp (speer) a little more than my Springfield 1911 that shoots a 115 a lot better. IU usually use a Federal Hydro Shok in it.

    I reload a lot but find it a lot less troublesome for me to not reload my carry ammo. I shoot with some local and state LEO and they get a little bent about reloaded carry ammo. The judges will too stating that reloading a hp for carry you are thinking ahead about killing someone. I really do not understand the mind set but I don't use near as much carry ammo so it's not a big deal.

    fivehourfrenzy: I'm not too far away from you (Rockcastle Co). That castle doct. really don't mean much of anything new to Ky residents. On paper it does saying things like the person no longer needs to be inside the house but there have been several people hung in court trying to practice it. If it were me I'd just stick to old school thought and wait them out till they are a good way in the door.

    My reloads are HP as well being I want to be able to know exactly what the slug is going to do and switching back and forth to me just don't make as much sense. FMJ ammo can indeed pass through a human target. That is one of the reasons I don't carry a 9mm much anymore. I learned from personal experience. I most the time have a 45 ACP with me but have been known to carry a 40 S&W or a 9mm at times. Sure the 45 makes a big mess but it usually wont pass through being a slower slug to begin with and with a HP slows down a lot faster.

    I do have a 12 ga that I use for home defense. I prefer a pistol mainly because I am more comfortable with it but I still keep one next to the bed.
    Last edited by DevilsJohnson; 03-01-2008 at 02:39 AM. Reason: Added a lil info

  19. #59
    Mike Barham's Avatar
    Mike Barham is offline Senior Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    Arizona, baby!
    Posts
    5,081
    Quote Originally Posted by Dredd View Post
    I'm confident that I can pop 2-3shots in COM with my pistol calibers much more than I am to hit on target with my 12 guage. Simply because I rarely shoot the shotgun and have alot of practice time in on the pistol. That's important too, confidence in your ability.
    I have no problem with that at all. A shooter should definitely use what (s)he's comfortable with. But don't discourage the use of better, more potent weapons - that many people find easier to use - by saying those users will go to jail or lose their assets for using something as prosaic as a shotgun or a revolver. Especially when those statements can't be back up with facts.
    Employed by Galco Gunleather - www.galcogunleather.com / Veteran OEF VIII

    Donate to the Christian and Stephanie Nielson Recovery fund: http://www.nierecovery.com/.

    All opinions, particularly those involving politics and Glocks, are mine and not Galco's.

  20. #60
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    Lexington
    Posts
    1,083
    Quote Originally Posted by DevilsJohnson View Post
    fivehourfrenzy: I'm not too far away from you (Rockcastle Co). That castle doct. really don't mean much of anything new to Ky residents. On paper it does saying things like the person no longer needs to be inside the house but there have been several people hung in court trying to practice it. If it were me I'd just stick to old school thought and wait them out till they are a good way in the door.
    Nice to meet someone else from KY. Yeah the Castle Doctrine says you can use deadly physical force if they're clearly attempting to break and enter. I still wouldn't try to blast them through the door...that's foolish in my opinion, especially if you can't 100% positively identify the person on the other side. I sat crouch behind a couch or table, set the sights on the door, and wait. That gives you a bit of time to identify the person entering so you don't go blowing your friend's head off, and if it takes a moment to get an ID, you're somewhat hidden as opposed to standing in broad view.

    When it applies to me, there aren't any "circles" or dead-ends in my apartment. Nothing branches off. You walk in and you have the kitchen on one side, the living room, then the steps going up behind you. Up the steps are two bedrooms. Pretty simple. I'll let them have whatever they want from downstairs. Once they come up those steps, lives are in danger, and after having 100% confidence that it's a home invader, they'll take 9mm JHPs in the forehead, or 00 buckshot in the forehead. My so-called "sniper's perch" is right outside my bedroom, and looks straight down to almost the first step, and a few feet beyond the steps are visible. Nobody would see me unless they looked straight up upon entering the stairway, and it would be pretty dark up there. We keep a light on right next to the stairway but it doesn't come up into where I'd be waiting. You can see a person in total light when they get near the steps or come onto them, but someone looking over the wall-rail thingy from just outside my room is damn near invisible.

    Oh yeah and I played football for Boyle County. BOTH years when we laid the smack down on Rockcastle at state.

Page 3 of 4 FirstFirst 1234 LastLast

Links

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

Search tags for this page

9mm 4gr unique
,

9mm favorite load

,
9mm load data unique
,
best 9mm ammo for ruger p95
,

favorite 9mm load

,

favorite 9mm loads

,
favorite 9mm target loads- high accuracy
,
favorite9mm accuracy loads
,
most accurate 9mm load
,
most accurate ammo for p30 9mm
,
recommended bullit oal for 9mm 115 gr
,
what ammo does ruger p95 used
Click on a term to search for related topics.

» Springfield Armory

» HGF Sponsors

Powered by vBadvanced CMPS v4.2.1