The Side Arm conundrum…

**Joeshwa24** · 11-26-2007, 04:34 PM

So here’s the deal, I have been carefully compiling information on Side arms for about the past 3 or 4 months knowing that in January 08 I would be making a purchase, the one that had come out on top was the Beretta PX4 in 40 S&W. I like this gun for several reasons. First its in expensive at $495 at sportsman’s warehouse that’s about $540 out the door with tax also it’s one of the lightest in its class, it comes with 2 15 round mags, and it has a relatively new barrel technology that drastically reduces felt recoil. Also it had the 2 things that I said I must have Ambidextrous de-cock, and an external Hammer.

Well a friend of mine Ben got his Springfield XD sub compact and I was over at his house last night drooling on it and well I really liked it. So now I have a bit of a dilemma you see I wanted to purchase my side arm from a local friend and parishioner (I am a Pastor), Mac, but when he quoted me on the Beretta it was at $622 out the door, well that’s super high and he quoted me $605 out the door for the XD 5 inch tactical model (I cant go compact because I’m kind of big guy and I hate having my hand hang off the bottom of the gun) this is a really good price for the XD Tactical as they run about $625 before tax at sportsman’s. However, the XD comes in at about 37oz where the PX4 is only 27oz, the XD’s high capacity Mag is only 12 rounds and the PX4 is at 15 rounds on top of all that the XD has no external hammer or any type of de-cock; in fact to de-cock you have to drop the mag pull the round from the chamber and pull the trigger. All that being said I like the XD’s feel much better than the PX4 and well I really want to buy from Mac, also while the XD only comes with 2 Mags it comes with a paddle holster, mag holder and mag loader and it has a 5 inch barrel as apposed to the PX4’s 4 inch barrel and I like that.

To add to the issue, I have 2 small children including an extremely inquisitive (and that’s putting it mildly) 3 year old daughter, now the pistol will at all times ether be on my hip or in the safe, no exceptions. However I would feel safer with a pistol that had more than just a back strap and trigger safety, but again I really want the XD. While I know this is a personal decision your opinions would be greatly appreciated.

Link to XD: http://www.springfield-armory.com/xd.php?version=107

Link to PX4: http://www.beretta.com/index.aspx?m=74&idc=2&ids=57

**Lucky7** · 11-26-2007, 04:46 PM

Joe you are caught between a rock and a hardplace with this issue. Personally, I would get the gun that you prefer in terms of comfort for shooting. A gun for self defense does not do you any good if the grip isn't just right. Don't settle for something that you aren't totally in love with. I have an XDSC40, it is my first pistol and I LOVE it. That being said, I do sympathize with you on the fact that it is a bit of a pain to decock the gun. I have not shot that particular Beretta, but they do build an extremely nice gun! Good luck with whatever you do decide to get.

**PhilR.** · 11-26-2007, 05:08 PM

Originally Posted by Joeshwa24

To add to the issue, I have 2 small children including an extremely inquisitive (and that’s putting it mildly) 3 year old daughter, now the pistol will at all times ether be on my hip or in the safe, no exceptions. However I would feel safer with a pistol that had more than just a back strap and trigger safety, but again I really want the XD.

If your choice is dependant on how safe it is around children, then you are better off not getting a firearm in the first place. A firearm's safeties, whether or not it has them, is a non-issue when it comes to children. You either keep them separated, or you don't get a firearm. There is no in-between.

I'm not trying to insult you by saying that, but you *really* need to look at that issue with a different perspective...

PhilR.

**JeffWard** · 11-26-2007, 05:18 PM

With the Pearce Grip mag extension, your grip worries are nil on the XD SubCompact. I'm 6'4" and 240lbs.

It grips fine, conceals fine, comes in 9mm or 40, and is availible under $500.

Jeff

**Lucky7** · 11-26-2007, 08:47 PM

Hey Jeff what holster do you use for concealed carry with the XDSC? I'm looking for a nice one.

**tnoisaw** · 11-26-2007, 09:39 PM

Get what handgun you feel is best for you and teach your kids to respect the firearms. I have a seven year old at home and I would have no worries with keeping my gun in the safe unlocked. Though it remains locked up if not on me.

I'm glad to see a pastor who is willing to carry. One of my brothers is a pastor but he would not and could not carry. He lives in Chicago and has never had any interest in guns. If there is one place where you need 'em it's in Chicago.

**Wandering Man** · 11-26-2007, 09:57 PM

I have the PX4 in 9mm and really enjoy the gun. Before buying, I was looking hard at the XD9, hard enough that I convinced my son (a pastor with a 3 year old daughter) to buy the XD with a 4" barrel.

The XD has the grip safety, rather than a decocker. There are a lot more choices out there for holsters for the XD than there are for the PX4. Personally I shoot the XD more accuartely than I do the PX4 (although I still love the gun).

There is no BAD choice. As mentioned above, buy what feels good, what you enjoy shooting the most. You will be buying a second gun eventually, so don't sweat it.

As far as price, sometimes we sacrifice price for freindship. Its up to you to decide how badly that pastor/parishner relationship will be hurt if you get the gun from a discount store. I sometimes pay too much for a gun at my range because I know I will get more back from them in goodwill and "extras" than I have lost in not buying from a competitor. Other times, I just go to the competitor. They are still happy to see me when I come through the door.

In the meantime, no matter which gun you buy, do what you said; keep the gun in the safe or use the lock that comes with it when you don't have it on you, and keep it away from your kids. Those are the only safety measures that really work.

WM

**Joeshwa24** · 11-26-2007, 10:22 PM

Originally Posted by PhilR.

If your choice is dependant on how safe it is around children, then you are better off not getting a firearm in the first place. A firearm's safeties, whether or not it has them, is a non-issue when it comes to children. You either keep them separated, or you don't get a firearm. There is no in-between.

I'm not trying to insult you by saying that, but you *really* need to look at that issue with a different perspective...

PhilR.

You’re absolutely right, I currently own an AK-47 and I keep it locked up but I keep playing out the worst case scenarios in my mind with the handgun. I am vigilant about teaching my kids about gun safety but at 3 years old and 7 months old they are just a little young.

Originally Posted by JeffWard

With the Pearce Grip mag extension, your grip worries are nil on the XD SubCompact. I'm 6'4" and 240lbs.

It grips fine, conceals fine, comes in 9mm or 40, and is availible under $500.

Jeff

Ha.. I am 6’4” and 230… its not so much the grip fit I knew I could fix that, its that I would rather have a full sized gun.

Originally Posted by tnoisaw

I'm glad to see a pastor who is willing to carry. One of my brothers is a pastor but he would not and could not carry. He lives in Chicago and has never had any interest in guns. If there is one place where you need 'em it's in Chicago.

Yeah I see it as a God given right to defend myself and my family, I think it makes me a better pastor.

Originally Posted by Wandering Man

As far as price, sometimes we sacrifice price for freindship. Its up to you to decide how badly that pastor/parishner relationship will be hurt if you get the gun from a discount store. I sometimes pay too much for a gun at my range because I know I will get more back from them in goodwill and "extras" than I have lost in not buying from a competitor. Other times, I just go to the competitor. They are still happy to see me when I come through the door.
WM

Yeah I am actually leaning toward buying the XD more simply because Mac is such a good guy and, as far as I can tell, a Tactical XD for 600 out the door is a really good price. I would concede a few extra bucks on the PX4 but 100 bucks is just to much extra to pay.

Thanks for all the comments guys, keep’em coming.

**Joeshwa24** · 11-27-2007, 10:57 AM

Yeah I think I am going to opt for the XD tactical, what really did it for me was that it is a single action only and if I have it on my hip with the kids around I will simply leave the chamber empty as the ultimate safety on a single action. The reason the question of safety came up so strongly was demonstrated to me last night as I was fitting the new M4 stock to my AK; Emma was watching Dumbo in my room, or so I thought, and as I was doing some filing (they make the Ak to M4 adapter a bit oversized so you file it to a perfect fit) she had snuck up behind me and before I could do anything she had grabbed the trigger and as she pulled it and the hammer came forward she shouted out "Let me try Daddy" (Which is the the 3 year old terrorist version of 'Alla a Chocolet bar' or what ever those rag heads say). Well luckily I had the gun totally apart and the only thing that got hurt was my left hand that got pinched between the hammer the firing pin. This gave me the opportunity to teach my daughter to respect fire arms by swiftly and repeatedly appling the hand of knowledge to the seat of learning and then sitting down and explaining why she was disciplined. It simply reminded me that the only thing you can really do with a Emma caliber child (Emma has the explosive combination of geniuses and mischievous) is to keep the chamber empty when she is around. She has a very watchful eye and I have no doubt that she will quickly learn how to disengage a safety, so realistically the single action only with no round chambered is the safest way to go.

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