Looking for some help/info-New Member
Hi, I did alot of thread reading and am more confused than ever. I live in IL (no concealed carry) but recently I have been traveling for work, and got my FL CC Permit. Until now I have only owned large frame .45's. I have been at the store looking at a new CCW and found a few I kinda like, but get different reviews about them. I must have nothing smaller than a 9mm, but I would not mind a larger caliber.
I am considering the Kahr P9 or P40-I would have to go with the P series because the smaller ones do not fit in my hand. I would rather have a 40 cal, but I heard it may be much harder to shoot than the 9mm
I really like the Sig 239, but seemed quite a bit heavier and larger than the other choices.
My other choice is the Walther PPS in 9MM, but have heard nothing about it (except the threads I read today)
My overall goal is to find a gun, first and formost I will be willing to carry at all times, large enough to shoot well, but small enough I don't end up leaving it at home. I am thinking of IWB carry, with an untucked shirt. I would like to also avoid pistols with external safties, I have never had one, and do not feel comfortable with one.
I was leaning to the kahr, until I heard quality complaints, and some lack of reliabilty. I made the mistake years ago buying a keltec P11 as my on duty back up weapon (when I was a reserve officer) the size was great, but would not hit the broadside of a barn.
Any thoughts, opinions, comments related to the above weapons would be appreciated as well as Carry options.
Sig makes some of the most rugged and reliable handguns out there, so you certainly won't go wrong w/a 239. However, I personally feel that a 239 is an expensive and bulky way to carry an eight round mag.. A Glock 26 will be slightly smaller, weight a lot less, cost a lot less, be just as reliable, and carry two more rounds. Of course, personal issues such as grip angle will play a big role in one's choice.
I have a Kahr as well, and I like it a lot. Makes a great CCW. Be aware though that the poly Kahrs can be problematic, which is something that you will not likely have to put up with if you buy a Sig/Glock/HK/Walther/Springfied/S&W. The all-metal Kahrs do seem to have a much better reliability record, and the one that I used (an MK9 belonging to a friend) is a 100% performer with an unbelievably good trigger.
The PPS has yet to establish a track record, but the P99 Compact is a very good choice to consider. It would however be a bit more expensive and likely harder to find locally than a Glock.
An S&W M&P compact might be worth looking at, as there is a promotion that has a $50 rebate and two extra magazines.
I currently favor shooting a Glock 21, so I am aware of the smaller glocks, but i find them to be too thick for concealment. As far as the kahrs go, how much more problematic is the polymer version over the steel version? (I found quite a weight difference between the 2) And are there any fixes for the poly versions?
Originally Posted by PhilR.
The poly Kahrs can range anywhere from 100% reliable to barely functioning, so one person could not quantify how much more problematic the polymers are. All I can tell you is that you are more likely to have a problem with a poly than a steel, but I can't tell you the extent of said risk. My PM9 did have a few minor problems at first, but now it runs 100%. I knew the risk of problems going in, but I'm still happy with the pistol as it makes such a nice CCW. Since you need a slightly bigger pistol, you might look at the CW series which are very similar in size and weight to the PPS. I've read some very good reports about the CW9, and you can't go wrong with the price.
Originally Posted by Harvick
The fixes are to send the pistol back to their birthplace and let the company fix them. Of course one must properly prepare the pistol for usage, which is not something that I would consider to be a "fix".
Originally Posted by PhilR.
I have read that an important thing with the Kahr poly frames is to put a lot of rounds through them before critiquing their reliability.
I have read that the first thing that should be done with a new Kahr is to put 200 rounds through it. During those first 200 rounds one may experience a casing hanging up/stove pipe jam. I'm reading that after the 200 round break in, the Kahr is flawless.
If the above doesn't hold true, please let me know because I'm really looking hard to get a Kahr PM40
Originally Posted by firemediceric
It *sometimes* doesn't hold true, because of peening issues that sometimes take more than 200 rounds to become noticeable. Then again, I haven't kept up with the PM40 model, so I don't know if it has the same issues as the PM9.
If I had to do it over again, I would go with the MK9 as it seems to have fewer problems overall than the PM9. I think they make an MK40 too , so you might look at that one as well.
My PM40 has been flawless since round number 250... Had it 7-8 months. I carry it ever day. I bump it, sit on it, feed it crappy walmart ammo... No issues.
I'm also 6'4" and the gun shoots fine. 3-finger grip... but managable. It's NOT a target gun. It's a CCW. That said, it's accurate as hell... I have LOTS of offhand sub-3" groups at 7M.
The only substantiated issues I've heard about Kahrs is:
1) Failure to fire issues in the fist 200-300 rounds. Even Kahr recommends a 400 round break-in.
The price is steep, vs a Glock, XD, M&P etc... But there is NO other gun as small, as accurate, and as reliable. Period. So you get what you pay for. You want compact (less that 1" thick), accurate, and reliable? Buy a Kahr, or buy a bigger gun.
I trust my life to it. And it goes in my right front pocket, of any pair of pants.
Lastly, spend $150 on an ArmaLaser sight. They are great too.
E-mail me when you're ready to sell. I would appreciate first refusal. I would also appreciate any sites you can point me to where I may find one for sale at a good used price.
Have you looked at the Glock 19 or 23.
I carry the G23 and now my 1911
hardly ever gets to spend a night on the town.
I realize the walther PPS is fairly new, but in general what do you all think of Walther. Never shot one, or held one for that matter. Generally are they reliable?
i haven't shot one yet but held it and it feels just like the P22 - to me
I would look at a smaller 45 like commander or officer models.
I have the P9 and have never had a moment's problem with it. With the extended mag you get a good grip and it is very thin and light for good comfort with an IWB holster. Like a lot of other guns, early problems earned the Kahrs problematic reputations that live on long after they've been resolved.
They are pricey, but are an excellent choice for a DAO concealment pistol.