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Thread: Is it just me?

  1. #1
    john doe. is offline Banned
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    Is it just me?

    This gets me every time I see it. Some guy standing at the stop light by Walmart with a homeless sign begging for money. He was in his late twenties or early thirties. He had all four limps, no crutches or wheel chair, he was standing on both pods and was not ugly. So why can't he work instead of beg? There's so many places looking for employees here that he would not have a problem.

    Is this not very Christian of me to be so tuff on him? I mean, I work 45-50 hours per week then I have four different side jobs to make extra cash. Give me a break.

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    Charlie's Avatar
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    Hey! That was me! I'm on vacation and needed a little extra cash! You cheap turkey!!!!!!

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    It's perfectly Christian of you to think that. The man doesn't need money. He needs a way to sustainably earn his own money.

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    He's begging for money because its easier/more convenient for him than working is. We live in a society where people expect extra compensation for doing their jobs. This guy is taking it to the next level - compensation for no work. Plus he gets to set his own hours and doesn't have a boss yelling at him for being a screwup.

    I've been out of work since October (by choice!) to stay home and take care of our son (15 months old). My wife and I made a choice to curtail our spending and rely on one salary so one of us could stay home with the baby until he's a bit older. That means no more pricey toys or vacations for a while, and means every $ is special and apreciated. It also means I'd have a hard time rounding up enough compassion to piss on a pan-handler's leg while he's running around on fire if he'd rather beg than work and is able-bodied enough to do so.

    If your concience is getting the better of you and you're worried about this guy, bring him a sandwich and some water and offer to drop him off at a shelter or church that will offer him counseling and assistance to get himself back on track. And be sure to post his reaction... I'd be willing to bet it won't be gratitude.

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    Up here in the rockies they disapear when the snow flies but it's just about the right time for them to return. Very migratory it would seem. I get mixed feelings when they are around. I'm sure that maybe one out of a hundred actually needs help. The rest are just scabbs. I try real hard to not judge them but.....well.......I do anyway and feel guilty about it.

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    +1 with Kev. There is a guy that sits all day at the on ramp of I-10 and Harper Rd. here in Kerr County. He makes plenty and he does not want food or help, just money. There are several around the interstate here that swap out corners periodically.

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    They had one down here they busted who owned two condos worth over a 1/2 million and had close to another million in the bank.
    Wife and daughters use to make up about a dozen bed rolls with food and stuff in them every year at Christmas time and give them out to the homeless. A women got knifed by a homeless guy and I made the quit. It's crazy now a days.

  9. #8
    john doe. is offline Banned
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    Quote Originally Posted by kev74 View Post
    He's begging for money because its easier/more convenient for him than working is. We live in a society where people expect extra compensation for doing their jobs. This guy is taking it to the next level - compensation for no work. Plus he gets to set his own hours and doesn't have a boss yelling at him for being a screwup.

    I've been out of work since October (by choice!) to stay home and take care of our son (15 months old). My wife and I made a choice to curtail our spending and rely on one salary so one of us could stay home with the baby until he's a bit older. That means no more pricey toys or vacations for a while, and means every $ is special and apreciated. It also means I'd have a hard time rounding up enough compassion to piss on a pan-handler's leg while he's running around on fire if he'd rather beg than work and is able-bodied enough to do so.

    If your concience is getting the better of you and you're worried about this guy, bring him a sandwich and some water and offer to drop him off at a shelter or church that will offer him counseling and assistance to get himself back on track. And be sure to post his reaction... I'd be willing to bet it won't be gratitude.
    Maybe that's what bothers me. My conscience is just fine. Sometimes I feel that I should feel sorry for people like that but unless they are obviously disabled then get a job man.


    One of my brothers lives in Chicago. He is a pastor and has hung out with many homeless there for years and even takes 'em in for Thanksgiving et. He said they have told him that they are homeless by choice and that 95% of them are the same way. They donít want to work and are happier in the street. Jezz, at least live where itís warm man. Chicago is cold with that Lake Michigan wind.

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    After watching an old boy sneak through some trees after leaving his "Begging Post" and crawl in to a new pickup truck to go home, I quit feeling sorry for them.


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    Quote Originally Posted by TOF View Post
    After watching an old boy sneak through some trees after leaving his "Begging Post" and crawl in to a new pickup truck to go home, I quit feeling sorry for them.

    +1 to that. Out here on the left coast, there are some guys that just choose to make their living that way. I imagine it is the same all across the country. Just this morning, on my way to work, there was a guy that I always see begging in front of a drug store. Today as I passed, he was talking on a cell phone.

    If everyone stopped giving them handouts, they wouldn't do it anymore, simple as that. I stopped a long time ago. Also, I stopped calling them "poor" or "homeless", and now call them what they are: "Beggars".

    Just as a disclaimer, I know there are some that are genuinely mentally/physically unable to work and function in society, but they should be in an institution of some kind, not out on the street. (After taking all the welfare abusers off the dole first, of course. )

    A couple of my new favorite anti-socialism sayings:

    "Stupid should hurt."
    "Want more? Work more."

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    When I was in business, I walked to and from work every day (about three miles each way).
    I made it a point to stop and talk to each and every guy on the street who was holding a "Will Work for Food" sign.
    I would hand out my business card, give simple directions to my workplace, and guarantee a good job at better than minimum wage.

    You guessed it:
    None of them ever showed up.
    None.
    Not one.

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    Todd is offline Banned
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    Quote Originally Posted by kev74 View Post
    I've been out of work since October (by choice!) to stay home and take care of our son (15 months old).
    All right, another Stay-At-Home-Dad!

    We have a guy in our area that is on the median almost every day. I look at him and think that if he can stand there for 8 hours a day, he can go work at a factory or fry a burger. Unfortunately, he probably makes more from handouts, and it's tax free, than he would if he actually did an honest day's work.

    I never give money to people unless it's something like a rest area on the highway and you see some guy fumbling for a nickel to buy his kid something out of the vending machine.

  14. #13
    hawcer's Avatar
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    I have seen the same at the parking lot entrace at walmart....it brings back a memory of childhood....

    One day after my family had been doing some grocery shopping,a "homeless" man approched my families station wagon(full of kids and groceries).He asked my dad if he had any extra money,so he could buy some food. "I haven't eat'n in like,4 days...and I'm starving" he said to my dad...

    As us kids watch,curious and interested in how our dad will handle the situation and generally feeling sorry for the guy...my dad proceeded to reach into the back seat and pulled a banana from a bag.

    "Here,if your hungry,have a banana...."

    The vagrant looked astonished and all he said was "uuuhh....thanks...." as he took the banana.I have to say ,they guy looked dissapointed.

    My dad then stated to us... "all he wanted was money for booze or drugs, At least he can't say that he's starving anymore..."

    Nowaday's ......they guy's standing in front a store holding a sign that states "WILL WORK FOR FOOD" he must not have read the sign on the door to that super market,it say's "NOW HIRING, APPLY WITHIN".

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    john doe. is offline Banned
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    Quote Originally Posted by hawcer View Post
    I have seen the same at the parking lot entrace at walmart....it brings back a memory of childhood....

    One day after my family had been doing some grocery shopping,a "homeless" man approched my families station wagon(full of kids and groceries).He asked my dad if he had any extra money,so he could buy some food. "I haven't eat'n in like,4 days...and I'm starving" he said to my dad...

    As us kids watch,curious and interested in how our dad will handle the situation and generally feeling sorry for the guy...my dad proceeded to reach into the back seat and pulled a banana from a bag.

    "Here,if your hungry,have a banana...."

    The vagrant looked astonished and all he said was "uuuhh....thanks...." as he took the banana.I have to say ,they guy looked dissapointed.

    My dad then stated to us... "all he wanted was money for booze or drugs, At least he can't say that he's starving anymore..."

    Nowaday's ......they guy's standing in front a store holding a sign that states "WILL WORK FOR FOOD" he must not have read the sign on the door to that super market,it say's "NOW HIRING, APPLY WITHIN".
    I like your dad. Sounds like something my dad would have done.

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    Was in Salt Lake City at the mall. A buddy and I were going to a cutlery store there. There were some people out there, they know what to look for. What sort of bag you are carrying denotes how much you spent and the likelyhood of weather or not you might have some extra cash. Well, I never carry cash, just plastic, but my buddy stopped when this healthy looking (read 'not bone skinny'), young lady, mid 20's asked for some change because she was starving. Well, being the people watcher that you become when carrying a gun for so long, I noticed she had a cat and that the cat was eating some of the canned wet cat food, the good stuff. Being there weren't any grocery stores near that mall, nor any place to buy cat food that I've ever seen, I had to ask myself... how the hell does a homeless hungry person justify buying high dollar cat food?

    Well, my buddy proceeded to hand her about $1.25, just what he had in his pocket. She says " uhhhgg... that's barely enough to buy a cup of coffee!" so, I grabbed it back and handed it to my friend and said... "Next time you might consider buying a loaf of bread if your hungry". I felt bad afterwards, but man it just irked me that someone who is supposedly starving would take that money and get a "Starbucks" or something! After that, I don't stop, if I feel the need, I'll buy a hamburger or something and drop it off to them on my way back, but no more money.

    Another time, when I was younger I ran a Pizza Hut. Couple comes in just about closing time and asked if I had any spare change, because they needed gas. I had a 5 gallon can of gas in the back of my truck... but as we all know, that's not what he wanted. What about some money for some food... I said I'd cook him a cheese pizza with the stuff I was about to throw out at closing. As it's about half way thru the oven, he has the gall to ask if I could throw some meat on it. I about blew up, but instead, I handed him a broom and said, "nothings free, empty the garbages in the restrooms and sweep the floor while it's cooking". I think he got my point, did so, and took his free pizza, free gas and proceeded to flip me off as he drove past the front doors. Sometimes they just wany your money, not your help. Pretty sad.

    Zhur

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    submoa is offline Member
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    What about people without health insurance and serious emotional and/or mental illness? Not all disabilities are visible.

    There are lazy, substance abusing panhandlers, but until you take the time to find out you only assume.

    +1 to giving out food and clothing but not money.

    "Where but for the grace of God, there go I."

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    I work in a highly infested area where moochers like to lerk. I was driving home last week and and older man had a sign that said "why lie it's for beer" I thought that was pretty good.

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    Most homeless people want to be homeless. And I'm not just saying that; it's straight from the horse's mouth. There's a talk radio show in the mornings I listen to and they've had homeless people on their show numerous times.

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    What about people without health insurance and serious emotional and/or mental illness? Not all disabilities are visible.
    I pay taxes every day to help those people! Is it my fault all the walking sperm banks keep popping out kids like a frick'n Pez dispenser,soaking up all the government funds so the people who would love to be able to work work for a living can't get any help?

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    submoa is offline Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by hawcer View Post
    What about people without health insurance and serious emotional and/or mental illness? Not all disabilities are visible.
    I pay taxes every day to help those people! Is it my fault all the walking sperm banks keep popping out kids like a frick'n Pez dispenser,soaking up all the government funds so the people who would love to be able to work work for a living can't get any help?
    I do not disagree with your point that recipients of government aid should be required to practice contraception. On the other hand, I disagree with your belief that unwashed smelly homeless people are desirably f*ckable.

    The point of the original quote is that not all disabilities are visible.

    One of our members recently pointed out that this is "National Autism Month." Without anyone to help, an autistic adult would have problems filling in the necessary forms and having the patience to get government aid, if available, much less keeping a job.

    I was at a business dinner once and a homeless guy was outside the restaurant was asking to bring him any leftovers after our meal. I bought him a takeout dinner and a bottle of water. And he was grateful.

    Socialism gives the poor money. Charity gives them what they need.

    Demonstrating some christian mercy won't make you less of a hardass, but it will make you more of a man.

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    hawcer's Avatar
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    .....I wasn't talking about the homeless popping out babies....I was tsalking about the 12-17 yr old teenagers!

    But Do I agree with the rest of your statement

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  24. #23
    john doe. is offline Banned
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    I posed the same question to family members and here is what my brother said. He’s the one in Chicago.

    “Having worked in downtown Chicago for several years, I've had my share of encounters with panhandlers - some quite funny, actually. I made an effort to get to know some and would occasionally treat one to a Burger King or something to sit and visit with them. There was also a group of homeless people that built their own little camp on an abandoned loading dock near the hospital where I worked. I would often spend lunch with them, taking them leftovers from a lunch meeting. What I learned was really most interesting.

    There were some that just hit hard times and did want to get a job, and were actively looking. They would panhandle between odd jobs and job interviews. These were usually pretty easy to spot, as they were usually well kempt, clean, showered, clean clothes - it was apparent that they were sincerely trying.

    There were your stereotypical drug addicts and alcoholics - dirty, stinking of stale booze, festering body odor, and dried urine. These guys would sleep wherever they happened to pass out - maybe on the sidewalk during rush hour with business executives, salesmen, and secretaries having to walk around - or over - them. Some would at least have the courtesy of making their way to their cardboard home on lower Wacker or lower Michigan Ave to pass out. But it didn't smell very good down there.

    A significant percentage of them turned out to be what I called "professionally homeless." Homelessness was their chosen lifestyle, and they actually considered panhandling their "job." Their freedom from any obligations to others was more important to them than food and shelter. They learned how to survive on the streets, where and how to keep warm in the winter, and where and how to keep cool in the summer.

    In talking with homeless people, I would ask them what percentage they would guess were professionally homeless. They would consistently give me a percentage in the 90s - over 90% were homeless by choice. Of course some of this percentage also included some of the druggies and alcoholics. Some of the druggies and alcoholics were not homeless by choice, homelessness being a consequence of their substance abuse. But some were both - substance abusers and homeless by choice. Others were homeless by choice, but not substance abusers.

    Through getting to know them and learning who they are and why they live the way they do, I came to this conclusion that might help you, Tony. I learned that if they are choosing to live that kind of life, it isn't my place to pass judgment on them. But nor am I obligated to subsidize their chosen profession. I am not their employer - I did not hire them to do what they are doing. Therefore, I don't owe them a wage or salary for their panhandling efforts.

    So it's a trade-off. I don't judge them, but nor am I obligated to help them.

    But there's another side to this. I have encountered the occasional bum who tried to impose upon me an obligation to help them. They would pester, threaten, and pass judgment on me if I didn't give them what they wanted. I was going to give one guy 5 bucks for a bowl of soup. He looked at it and said he wanted a steak dinner in the restaurant we were standing in front of, so that wasn't near enough money. I put my $5 back in my wallet and walked away, his curses echoing through the streets behind my back.

    Then there were a few occasions where they would ask me for money for a sandwich. I told them that I didn't have the money, but I did have a sandwich and would hand them the sandwich Sally made for me for lunch. They'd look at it like it was a moon rock or something and walk away. I guess it wasn't the kind of sandwich they had in mind.

    There was also the guy that would sit all curled up in a hoody with the homeless sign in front of him asking for help. He had the pathetic look down like a real pro. He would look up on occasion with big, sad eyes like a beat up puppy. I happened to run into a homeless lady from the loading dock group. She wanted to introduce me to a new friend of hers - the pathetic guy. When she introduced us, he jumped up, shook my hand with a big, friendly smile on his face. As I was turning to leave, he resumed his pathetic position and went back to work.

    If someone chooses to be homeless, and if I choose to treat them to a burger or something, it will be on my own terms, not theirs. I owe them nothing, and they are in no position to obigate me to give them anything at all. I won't pass judgment on them - and I expect the same respect from them.

    Hope that helps put things in perspective for you.”

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    Steve M1911A1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spartan View Post
    Most homeless people want to be homeless. And I'm not just saying that; it's straight from the horse's mouth. There's a talk radio show in the mornings I listen to and they've had homeless people on their show numerous times.
    We have one of these living on our property right now.
    She lives in an old motor-home that someone gave her, and she is a one-day-a-week caregiver to a local quadraplegic man for her food money.
    In return for the space to park her "home," and the little electricity and water she uses, she does light yard work for us, and keeps our critters fed when we go away for a day or two.
    She's feisty, bone honest, and a self-starter. We love having her around.
    And don't mess with her: she has a .22 rifle and knows how to use it.

  26. #25
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    The guy that I used to work for owns a construction business. He told me about one day on his way home, as he merged off I-65, there was a homeless man waiting on the corner at the stoplight of the exit ramp. My former boss said that he rolled down his window and offered the man a laborer's position on the spot for $9.00 an hour. The homeless man laughed at him, and said he makes more than that on his street corner.


    But the one that got me is similar to what someone had previously said. I was waiting at a stop light, and noticed a homeless man at the corner of an exit ramp holding his sign. Well, three cars behind me was a police officer. When the homeless man spotted the patrol car, he very quickly dropped his sign, and started walking the other way, but not before he took a cell phone from of his pocket and began having a conversation.

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