Originally Posted by hemmigremmie

I know the the p3at by keltec is a lot lighter, but whats the big difference other than that? Are the Bersa guns reliable? Thinkin on gettin one. HG

For what purpose? Pocket carry? IWB carry?

Personally, if I was going to go with a .380 it would be for pocket carry. In that case, it makes much more sense to go smaller and lighter. The P3AT (or Ruger LCP) is lighter and smaller than the Bersa. So, why go with the bersa? If you're going to go IWB, than the Bersa isn't much easier to conceal than your Taurus either I wouldn't think. What would it's purpose be?

I will own a P3AT or Ruger LCP in the near future. I don't see any Bersas in my future. There are plenty of people that have no issues with the Bersas at all, but if I was going for a gun that would for the most part be a BUG or an ultra-concealable type gun (the only reasons to go with a .380 IMO), than it would be the smallest possible (Read - P3AT, LCP). Just my .02

-Jeff-

pocket carry p3at or lcp. iwb either xd9sc or glock 26 I believe for ultra concealable. I've been hunting down the pocket carry/ultra concealed and these would be my choice IMO.

I agree with the other guys. The only real purpose of a .380 these days is as a pocket gun, and the KelTec clearly wins for pocket carry versus the Bersa. The Bersa is as big as a lot of 9mms and .40s. Why carry a .380 as a belt gun when you can carry a more powerful gun?

Is the P3at the same as the Ruger LCP??

Originally Posted by BigMatt

Is the P3at the same as the Ruger LCP??

The LCP is basically a copy of the P3AT.

The bersa will probably be more comfortable, size wise, for a larg handed person, harder to pocket carry tho (as has been stated yes). Nicer (read less noticable recoil) to shoot, and my appeal more to someon concerned with that. You don't strike me as too concerned with felt recoil, but, if say your wife/gf/mom/sister might be looking for a smaller purse gun with less kick than a 9mm, a bersa (or walther, or feg) might be better suited. So again, for what purpose?

I am looking at either a Bersa UC9 or M&P 9c as an iwb carry.

I wonder if the LCP or the p3at is more reliable?

Originally Posted by BigMatt

I wonder if the LCP or the p3at is more reliable?

I have no track record with the LCP, but all the P3ATs i have shot have been 100%. They have been around longer to work out any unforseen issues also.

Early P3ATs got something of a bad rap, but KelTec fixed the problems and they seem to run fine now. Mine runs 100%, as do those that belong to two of my colleagues.

I might go buy me a p3at this evening. What ammo do you guys use in 380 for a decent defense round?

Originally Posted by BigMatt

I might go buy me a p3at this evening. What ammo do you guys use in 380 for a decent defense round?

Any premium JHP from a major manufacturer will be fine, as long as it works reliably. I use Gold Dot.

For those of you that have shot both, is the felt recoil that much of a difference between the two? And especially any women, which is more comfurtable to you to shoot?

The Bersa 380 Thunder is a double action, has a external hammer which you can cock, with a round in the chamber, or take the saftey off and fire. Each time fired the hammer is in the cocked position. The Kel-Tec is a single action, round in he chamber where the hammer has to travel the entire distance each time you fire which makes it less accurate IMO. Correct me if I am wrong. LOVE YALL

Originally Posted by wildcatbrownhound

The Bersa 380 Thunder is a double action, has a external hammer which you can cock, with a round in the chamber, or take the saftey off and fire. Each time fired the hammer is in the cocked position. The Kel-Tec is a single action, round in he chamber where the hammer has to travel the entire distance each time you fire which makes it less accurate IMO. Correct me if I am wrong.

The Kel Tec is DAO (Double Action Only). It cannot be cocked manually, therefore making it impossible to be a single action gun.

Steve summed up the difference pretty well in a past thread:

Originally Posted by Steve M1911A1

SA (Single Action) = the trigger feels the same, always. The trigger pull is short, and can be pretty light.
DAO (Double-Action Only) = the trigger feels the same, always. The pull is usually long and relatively heavy. This is a useful option, for instance for a pocket-carry pistol.
DA/SA ("Traditional" Double Action) = in a semi-auto, the trigger feels long and heavy for your first shot, and then switches to relatively short and light for all subsequent shots. Some people find that the transition from DA first shot to SA subsequent shots negatively affects speed and accuracy. But in a revolver, you have the choice of DA or SA for each shot, at your option, and pay no transition penalty.

Originally Posted by undrgrnd

pocket carry p3at or lcp. iwb either xd9sc or glock 26 I believe for ultra concealable. I've been hunting down the pocket carry/ultra concealed and these would be my choice IMO.

After getting my CCW recently I have been thinking along the same lines. Although, I limited my choices to Kel-Tec P3-AT vs. Kel-Tec PF-9. I opted for the PF-9, had some issues out of the box and have sent it back for repair. Having had it for a few days my observation is that even on a large frame guy (6'-2"/285#) the PF-9 is NOT a pocket gun. However, in a deep IWB holster it should be infinitely more concealable than my Beretta 92FS!

Knowing that Kel-Tec will probably have my PF-9 for a month or more, and getting frustrated with carrying my Beretta, I may just go back and pick up a P3-AT as well. It just seems like the logical thing to do

Originally Posted by Todd

The Kel Tec is DAO (Double Action Only). It cannot be cocked manually, therefore making it impossible to be a single action gun.

Steve summed up the difference pretty well in a past thread:

Well,I got some of it backwards. Sorry! I think you knew what I was trying to say. I meant the harder it is to pull the trigger the less accurate. I have the Colt Cobra in my avatar and when you cock it, it is the most accurate gun i have as opposed to just pulling the trigger. (I hit a basketball 5 of the 6 at 50yards.) in the cocked position. Pretty good shooting for a old man HUH. Good info. THANKS.

Originally Posted by wildcatbrownhound

Well,I got some of it backwards. Sorry! I think you knew what I was trying to say. I meant the harder it is to pull the trigger the less accurate. I have the Colt Cobra in my avatar and when you cock it, it is the most accurate gun i have as opposed to just pulling the trigger. (I hit a basketball 5 of the 6 at 50yards.) in the cocked position. Pretty good shooting for a old man HUH. Good info. THANKS.

Accuracy has more to do with the user than with the trigger action. Practice, practice, practice...

-Jeff-

Originally Posted by Dynamik1

After getting my CCW recently I have been thinking along the same lines. Although, I limited my choices to Kel-Tec P3-AT vs. Kel-Tec PF-9. I opted for the PF-9, had some issues out of the box and have sent it back for repair. Having had it for a few days my observation is that even on a large frame guy (6'-2"/285#) the PF-9 is NOT a pocket gun. However, in a deep IWB holster it should be infinitely more concealable than my Beretta 92FS!

Knowing that Kel-Tec will probably have my PF-9 for a month or more, and getting frustrated with carrying my Beretta, I may just go back and pick up a P3-AT as well. It just seems like the logical thing to do

What was wrong with your PF-9? I was thinking of getting one, actually. Either that or the PF-11. How does it handle with other 9 mm you have shot?

Originally Posted by nighthawk74

What was wrong with your PF-9? I was thinking of getting one, actually. Either that or the PF-11. How does it handle with other 9 mm you have shot?

New PF-9 Range Report

I'm not real impressed with my P11 but I do like revolvers better anyway.

Besides a heavy trigger the takedown pin will come out during heavy shooting or basically when it gets hot. Of course this causes the slide/barrel/recoil spring to dump out on the ground, very embarrassing at the range.

Perhaps the pin is worn out?

Contact Kel-tec service on that. I have used my p-11 for IDPA championship shoot (no i am not that good. i was almost last)
with no problems. I would be wary of any pistol that fell apart shooting also. Course i would work on fixing it too.

Originally Posted by niadhf

Contact Kel-tec service on that. I have used my p-11 for IDPA championship shoot (no i am not that good. i was almost last)
with no problems. I would be wary of any pistol that fell apart shooting also. Course i would work on fixing it too.

Well I've done that and awaiting a response.

Good luck with your IDPA shooting

Hmm...

From much of the postings, it seems like, out of the box, one can expect that you might have to send in your new Kel-Tec gun back to the manufacturer........with the end result of getting a better gun because someone had to fix it. Has this indeed been the case for lots of KT gun owners out there? In this forum and in others, I've taken this to be the case. I haven't seen as many people saying the same thing about their Bersas, though.

I don't know. It's nice that Kel Tec will take care of your gun after sending it in but isn't it better to have a gun that is ready to go in your pocket holster for your personal defence? I would rather buy a gun that is quality and user-ready. Like Ruger, Kel Tec sounds kind of hit-and-miss to me. I guess I'll stick to the Glock and Sig for my piece of mind.......and MAYbe, just maybe, a Bersa 380 for the price.